did u look inside the filter? or filters if you did both ?

the shavings in the pan is a little worrisome but the fines on the magnet if minimal is normal

then again most folks push these way past the 30k interval

 

Both filters looked clean considering, no shavings in pickup or canister. Pan filter said Ford on it. I had to use powercore all that parts store had in stock. I am curious if pan had ever been dropped did not seem like it had. If anything previous owner may have had a drain and flush done. No fluid change on oasis and would be surprised if it was taken to a shop and they used OEM parts.

 

You can have the transmission fluid completely flushed out and then replaced.

Ford will do it for you. It will cost around $250.00 and I have had it done on my trucks. They call it a hot flush and when I have time am going to have my truck done.

 

Sweet, will definitely look into this then. Was hoping there was an easy way for us to do the same. But at that cost seems better for them to do.

 

If you have a lot of miles on the tranny and have not been hot flushing on the maintenance cycle then I wouldn't do it. Just keep changing it every 30k miles or so. Hot flushing could lead to tranny failure quicker if you haven't been keeping up with it on the regular cycle.

 

curious how a hot flush fluid exchange would lead to a failure ?

maybe he should put the shavings back in the pan to play it safe ?

 

That's what the dealership service department told me when I asked about flushing my tranny at 111000 miles. Told me because I never had it done on the maintenance schedule they said flushing now could cause tranny slippage. They said dump and fill unless you flush every 30k from new. That's what I did, now have 125k and no tranny issues at all.

 

well here is the real deal


the OEM heated flush is simple no voodoo / no chemicals /no back flowing flushing
pre heated truck trany at 170* + = oil flowing to the coolers

heated new oil in flush machine 170*+ ( so the cooler circuit in the trany stays open )

hot fluid leaves the trany and is taken out of the cooler loop and new heated fluid is put in it's place .

the advantage is instead of doing multiple pan drops and cross contaminating the fluid you swap old for new and no mixing


I also heard there is no chance of increasing a transmissions likelihood to fail by using this procedure and I heard this from one of the original 5r engineers

but it also just makes sense without an engineers input ( at least to me )

that if someone thinks the grit in the system is holding your clutches from slipping then wouldn't you think the trans is done anyway

 

You are bloody well right I must say. I've heard guys say that the flush can knock stuff loose and wind up raising hell with the transmission.

But they drop pain and clean it as needed and install new filter. Then the fluid in entire transmission system including cooler etc is purged with new fresh stuff. So every drop of old oil is pushed out of the system and replaced with new.
Transmission fluid is crazy high in detergent and the transmission is the cleanest mechanical item by far in the truck. But the fluid is under a lot of pressure and heat and it degrades.
I have never been a fan of dump and fill. I remember years ago pushing transmission fluid out of my Chevy truck with compressed air. It worked pretty well actually.
Anyways replacing all of the oil is the only way to go.....

Would you be ok draining 5 quarts out of your 6.0 replacing the filter and topping it back off. I already know the answer.

 

I spend most of time in another forum and just occasionally scan over here. This is what I recently posted and may be relavent to the thread.

Shot in HD as are all my vids, view in YouTube and force a 720p view to see better detail.

(Tap the title bar at the top of the video box; at YouTube tap the three vertical dots at the top right; select the quality gear icon; select 720p).

 

I spend most of time in another forum and just occasionally scan over here. This is what I recently posted and may be relavent to the thread.

Shot in HD as are all my vids, view in YouTube and force a 720p view to see better detail.

(Tap the title bar at the top of the video box; at YouTube tap the three vertical dots at the top right; select the quality gear icon; select 720p).

https://youtu.be/Ha8xa7kRcvg

Thanks for posting that up. Has me now thinking about upgrading my pan and filter.

Will need to look at the 6.4 pan to see where it drops down at to make sure it will clear my crazy brace between the radius arms. There was a fair amount of metal mesh in that filter setup. I don't see any reason to pay for those fancy aftermarket pans that look really cool.
Maybe they do have some additional cooling factors to them ? I've seen it stated that they give transmission case more rigidity and that it is less likely to fracture and crack. But is that something that even happens....??

Again thanks Toyguy that was a nice workup.

 

Thanks.

The conversation that were related from that work from Mark K, who as before has stated the aftermarket pans nor the extra fluid does nothing to provide extra cooling. I had another segment in that video that I had to delete for time which was a post pan change run under the same conditions and ambient showing no difference in trans temp.

Mark also later commented on the video what was in the 6.0L filter assembly would be expected after 200k miles, so while I was disassembling the filter I was concerned, Mark's comments eased that.

As far as rigidity, the only structural failures I've ever seen over the years were from driveshaft issues hurting the case or PTO issues where the fluid path was blocked, locking the PTO pump and shearing it off the case.

 

Mark does not care for the deep pan

but facts are facts
extra fluid takes longer to heat up and longer to cool down

it can make the difference on a hill climb IMO

also if your deep pan relocates the filter deeper in the pan it can make a difference in a fluid loss situation

the 5r has no removable bell housing cover and while this is a pain for removing the Torque converter bolts it is by design for rigidity IMO
IDK if a cast pan is any benefit I tend to agree that in this application it is not

the 08 filter vs the screen
a great upgrade I thought, but when a component in mine let loose the whole unit was contaminated
since the fluid that heads to the coolers is only 10% filtered and the rest dumps to the back of the transmission (not the pan)

it really wasn't that big of an upgrade after all IMO plus the 08 pan filter is a bypass so it will open a door if blocked and suck up crud anyway

i have not reinstalled my 08 pan and Derale deep pan on my new transmission

 

So you think the 6.0 pan and filter is neither here or there. lol
You have one part go and it's all over anyways. I'm going to at least hot flush my system for sure but I'm also going to look at the newer pan to see if it will still fit in my truck.

I guess when you get down to it our engines bypass the oil filter as well depending on speed temps etc.
One things for sure I won't drain 5-6 quarts out of it and change the filter and I feel the same about the transmission.

 

The design of the '06 methodology is a two stage filtering. The mesh for the coarse particles and the bypass filter for those that could interfere with the particles that can interfere with the solenoids. Fine filtering is limited by the bypass function, and is further reduced during cooler transmission operation. For my truck which typically runs cool, I'm not in a position to determine if I just run operate in a low intensity situation or I have more fluid flow throw the cooler all the time. Never the less ......

The Job 2 design has a finer filter that should catch even the fines that can inhibit the solenoids and it filters all the time. How often do the solenoids have an issue, probably not often based on histories.

The modification does two things. It extends the fluid changes to 60k miles instead of 30k. So if your keeping the truck for another 120k miles it's a wash in costs. It provides better filtering. If you are one who uses Motorcraft oil and fuel filters, installs coolant filters and use both fuel and oil additives, this modification fits the mold. Again, 120k miles, no cost.

I had a hard time justifying this upgrade based on the mileage on my truck. Looking at the particles in the '03 version screen and Mark K saying the '03 in pan screen does not stop the fines full time that could interfere with the solenoids but the '08 filter would was reassuring to me I did the right thing. I'd rather improve my chances of not having a valve body issue away from home pulling my trailers.

But we all have to make our own decision on if modifications to our trucks are worth the cost and effort.

If you have a catastrophic failure in the trans, no filtering in the world is going make it any better. It's toast.

 

well here is what i have now

i full flow filter filtering all fluids coming from the coolers . it will bypass if it clogs

and yes the OEM TP filter only filters 10% of the flow and being it is in the cooler circuit that can be a minimal flow also so 10% of 10% of the flow to the coolers is
a lame plan IMO but it has worked fine for years

the 08 job 2 60,000 k interval also changed with the LV fluid vs SP so i am not ready to give the 08 filter all the credit

can an 08 filter hurt ? not in my opinion

but you have to leave the OEM TP filter in place or remove the whole filter manifold otherwise you will loose cooling due to a short cycle

 

I'm not sure how LV fluid filters out more particulates.

And you going to have to explain how removing the TP element alters any cooling ability or changes the flow characteristics or that it must be removed. I not following. Btw, I left it in.

Agreed the original design has worked well. I'm glad I have a little better.

 

The '08 pan and filter definitely does not hurt anything and it will help filter out some of the "fines" as they have been referenced. IMO, it's a minimal cost for a bit better filtration. I wouldn't do it (and didn't do it) until I was planning on fluid change, but at that point, why not do it? My trans temps did not change after the upgrade, nor did I expect them to. At least not after a full heat soak, I would imagine that it does take slightly longer to get up to temp with the additional fluid, but not much.

 

not sure whom stated LV filters better ? perhaps you made your own conclusion?

my statement merely pointed out that when the 08 tranny dictated a 60,000 vs the 07 under 30,000 service interval not only did the filter type change but the fluid type changed also not to mention some internal changes ( those i do not believe effected the recommended interval )



I guarantee if you remove the TP filter the fluid will not choose to fight the path of most resistance and it will pass through the opening you left when you remove the filter from the filter manifold

i have actually tested this with clear tubing and a flush machine and the fluid bypassed the coolers 100% with the filter removed

 

Now I understand your point about the interval changes, I wasn't clear before from what you wrote. So your saying Ford has noted with switching to the LV fluid that we can double the change intervals over the SP as its a more robust fluid? I had not heard that before and I thought it was only a viscosity change.

I also now understand your comment on the external filter now that you restated it. I've got the filter in place so no worries there, and wasn't planning on going without the element in place.

---------------------

Guys I'm not worried about doing the hot flush. I've taken out an extra quart of the system with the pan removal compared to normal drains, and added an additional quart with the new pan. I'll do a 30k changeout with a new filter and pan drop, so the new/old percentages will even be better, and of course the improved filtration. I'm good.

 

From the watching the video, the pan and filter upgrade are not really needed. Kinda like doing head gaskets before there really is a head gasket problem.

 

I think it's a good idea honestly, anytime you can improve on the filtering I think is a win. Is it the answer to keeping the debris out of the transmissions sensitive parts solenoids etc unfortunately no.
When Toyguy said it can take a 2 hour drive to fully process all the oil through the filter assy it put things into perspective. The filtering design sucks and that's for sure. Maybe I took it wrong or misunderstood it but that stinks if that is about right.

Is there a filter setup that can installed in the line up to the cooler that can process all of the oil ?? If so that's what I want lol.

Until then I'm getting the pan and filter and having it installed when they hot flush it. From that point on all I can do is cross my fingers and hope the Transmission Gods are smiling down on me.

 

I'm curious about this swap. So to "TooManyToys". How many miles so far with the new pan and fluid? I'm actually considering this since I don't know if any fluid change was ever done to my truck and currently has 140k miles?

 

So your saying Ford has noted with switching to the LV fluid that we can double the change intervals over the SP as its a more robust fluid? I

thats not what i posted

I guess the only thing left for us though is a company to come up with some bypass valves to tap into the return line before it goes back into the pan

those fittings won't do you any good the cooler circuit is only flowing 10% when the trans is below 170* there is no way open the circuit manually or with a computer signal

thats why you need the heated " fluid exchange machine" or multiple fluid drain and fill

 

The trannies in these trucks are tough.....

 

neither version of the filters stinks IMO unless you have the bell housing short run unit

you don't see a lot of tyranny issue from fines in the fluid but when a component goes it's all over the place

my coolers were ruined and there was paste everywhere

i now run the diesel site inline filter just in case i missed anything doing the cooler line
flushes

 

For the cost difference and the fact that I plan on keeping the truck for at least 120k miles makes this conversion worth it IMO. Plus the fact that if the fluid was never changed, I was looking at a fluid/filter change anyway so why not