GEM is dying -- possibly has water in it

 

Maybe I will check it tomorrow I believe the GEM for the year 2000 is behind the fuse panel in the driver side? Maybe? However I have no issues whatsoever with the AC motor the windows the locks etc. It’s just like the electronics won’t turn off. So even when the programmer was turning on and off I put the key in the ignition turn the truck on turn the truck off took the key out closed the doors but then it kept trying to turn on. So with a programer you turn it on the edge evolution screen turns on says it’s loading files then the gauges pull up and then when you turn off the truck the engine the gauges in the screen go black. However with this situation the screen turns on gauges load screen turns black screen turns on gauges load screen turns black it’s like it’s trying to start itself or like the electronics never really get shut off but I could go put the batteries in right now start it run it everything works just fine but it just won’t disconnect the power once the key in the ignition is turned off

 

GEM is a common failure from a leaking windshield seal, you may have a short in the harness, or something totally different.

for now disconnect the battery grounds when you park the truck

 

Yup I did. I was upstairs in my house and saw the cab light on I’m not sure what you call it it’s the third brake light that’s above the bed of the truck like when you open your door the light comes on but the light was on with all the doors closed and that’s what got my attention I have no clue how many days this stuffs been doing this

However the starter relay if for some reason it was corroded could it allow electricity to still run even with the ignition off. This gets confusing I do not mean solenoid attached to the starter motor. And I do not mean a relay in the fuse box I don’t believe there is a relay for this year make and model. I mean the relay that is under the hood attached the passenger side of the engine bay. It looks exactly like the glow plug relay that is brown AutoZone calls it the starter solenoid but that’s confusing because the starter itself also has a solenoid attached to it. So that starter solenoid attached to passenger side of engine bay is the original one which is over 21 years old it’s a $30 part so I figure if it’s corroded or broken it might not be shutting off the electronics to the vehicle will find out tomorrow

 

The reason for the multi-tiers is that the harness or ignition switch, would not handle the full load of the starter solenoid -- that one can pull 50 amps easily, just to operate it

The fender relay only operates (sends power to) the starter solenoid, so it would not affect the other parts of the truck like that
any electrical part that is corroded, should be addressed -- either cleaned or replaced -- corrosion can/will carry electricity, and can/will seek the opposite polarity

pull those ground cables -- all will be quiet at night

 

So do you think it would be the GEM? With ignition off what allows power to get to my edge evolution CTS programmer and cycle it on and off

 

Depends on where it is powered from
Lights on the dash coming on?

 

None of the lights were on in the dash it was daylight so I didn’t really notice. The dome light was on and the third brake light was on which made me think one of the doors was left open. But all the doors were shut. And the door ajar light turns on and off properly. But I turn the ignition for forward and then off took the key out but The programmer cat cycling on and off

Do you know what cuts the power to the truck when you turn the ignition off

 

None of the lights were on in the dash it was daylight so I didn’t really notice. The dome light was on and the third brake light was on which made me think one of the doors was left open. But all the doors were shut. And the door ajar light turns on and off properly. But I turn the ignition for forward and then off took the key out but The programmer cat cycling on and off

Ii had the same problem. Sticking door light switch either drivers or passenger.
Spray a whole can of wd40 all around door switch and anywhere you find an opening to get penetrant in the door and electric switch/relay.
Open and close door 78 times and I bet your lights will go out.

 

Figure out where the programmer gets power and that may shed some light on the problem -- you should be able the trace the power wire back

Not really, I dont have a wiring diagram for your year

 

That’s plugged into the shoot I forgot what you call it the scan port you know like when you check your engine diagnostics can’t believe I forgot the name of it. You know like when you go to AutoZone to check your engine check light that’s where the program is plugged into

 

Yeah, ...OBD port

So yeah, ...fuse 12 feeds the cigar lighter and the OBD port power (on the 2002 model) yours may or may not be the same -- check the owners manual fuse layout

 

Lol thank you 🤦‍♂️

That’s why I was figuring it was starter power issues just not disconnecting. Could be GEM I will take it out look for corrosion, burns ect. Gotta go to walmart get them charged again pick up fender solenoid take out gem and get its numbers for eBay. I’ll also upload images as well.

 

Lol thank you 🤦‍♂️

Don't look now but when mine did very strange things with the light(s), it turned out that the instrument cluster had problems. I understand it is a common problem. I took the cluster out and sent it to Circuit board medics. When returned there were no more problems. It may sound strange but there's a lot of control going through the instrument cluster. It doesn't cost anything to call CBM at 800 547 2049

 

Buy a battery charger while you are there -- one of those 5 or 10 amp kind
charge the batteries your self

 

Good idea.

So I got the batteries charged. Then got a FORD OEM starter fender relay solenoid. Then I took the fuse box out. Cleaned all the layers with wire brush, and then globbed with dielectric grease. The GEM was completely fine. Put it all back together and it works? Now it might randomly turn on in a few days but if not then it was one of those two problems. So far all the lights go out and stay off. There was water in the last layer so I will look into getting my windshield replaced???? It’s weird I don’t see any signs of WATER AT ALL!! No water stains no moisture nothing🤷‍♂️ But it was in the fuse box the last layer had a puddle of water? It rained all day I got in the truck used a light with doors closed no signs of any leak at all?but so far so good I will call safe lite to install a new windshield. Oh by the way you have to have an angle grinder aka dremmel and grind off the spots where my two fingers are otherwise you won’t be able to pull the bolts out or separate it at all.

That sticker for the GEM is for a 2000 Ford F-250 XLT ,4x4 , automatic 4R100. Power lock and windows

 

All that blue green stuff in the connector and on the boards is evidence of water damage -- the corrosion is both conductive of electricity, and an insulator -- go figure -- the white stuff insulated, the blue stuff conducts -- some electrical cleaner and a nylon bristle brush should buff the crud off -- you can get a handy brush pack at the hardware store

Anyways, no need to replace the windshield -- they can remove and re-seal it
also check the area at the wiper pivot arms, if leaves and other junk builds up enough it can leak water there
will drip right down on the fuse box

 

Yeah it’s really weird because when I had the fuse box out I shining a flashlight everywhere didn’t notice any water drip lights but in the fuse box there was a literal puddle of water must’ve been building up for a long time small amounts. I did clean all of the stuff off and rebuilt it works perfectly now. And as far as the gunk every single seal is full of Pineneedles and dirt so maybe that’s what was happening but I will be putting some clear caulking around the rubber Seal that’s $500 to get the window replaced but the windows fine so I’ll just put some clear caulking around it

I don’t mean to be confusing when I was shining a light I was inside the truck looking up in the dash area where the steering column is.

 

Yeah it’s really weird because when I had the fuse box out I shining a flashlight everywhere didn’t notice any water drip lights but in the fuse box there was a literal puddle of water must’ve been building up for a long time small amounts. I did clean all of the stuff off and rebuilt it works perfectly now. And as far as the gunk every single seal is full of Pineneedles and dirt so maybe that’s what was happening but I will be putting some clear caulking around the rubber Seal that’s $500 to get the window replaced but the windows fine so I’ll just put some clear caulking around it

I offer this caution, your windshield is considered a structural component of the vehicle. Think rigidity. If the urethane sealant is beginning to fail, you may want to have the glass pulled and resealed. A good glass shop can cut the urethane, without breaking the glass. Placing clear silicone/sealer over the original seal may stop the leak but only temporary. The force/pressure of air against the windshield while driving will continue to challenge the integrity/security of the glass. It can actually dislodge from the mounting aperture. Rather exciting at Hwy speeds. Just saying……

 

Green stuff bad. Conductive and voltage across it will eat up electrical components. Find out where water came from, you might want to consider getting another fuse block from salvage yard and replace it because Corrosion is still there where you couldn't see.

 

So far replacing the fender starter relay solenoid amd removing the fuse box. Scrubbing all 5 layers totally clean, rebuilding it with globs of dielectric grease none of the problems have started up again. Before the truck by itself just turned on the lights? Would not go out. I mean literally I came home closed the door truck is off, all lights are off look outside and on it’s own the lights were on? Doors shut ignition off. Run down stairs programer is cycling on and off??? I can see it through the window. Batteries totally drained lights burning hot must have been on for a long time. 24-48 hours. The truck ran fine with the fuse box jacked up. But it was so corroded all that water must have been connecting metal layers in the box🤷‍♂️ The starter relay was also corroded and 21 years old🤷‍♂️ However so far all is now back to normal after fixing those two things.

As far as where the water came from no clue? No sign of water in cab, behind dash/ steering column. However the window wipers in that grill area and where the seal connects to the hood totally full Pineneedles dirt crap I mean to the brim!!! The window seems totally fine as far as the seal you would think they would be water stains or at least some sort of puddle inside the cab behind the dash area where the fuse box goes but it must be really minuscule and must’ve been years and years of one drop just collecting I do have a plastic bag on top of it now how many pull it out and about a week after the rain and see if the plastic bag is wet

 

Now I still have like the key is on with my 00 and it is when it is damp that it does it. So it has become a puppy truck and goes into the garage at night. The rain does not seem to affect it just dampness inside the cab. I did replace the fuse box as it was just a big mess.Other times I just disconnect the battery and yes it is a pain but it starts when leaving work and that is very important. Have been told that is does not take much and the wiper seals is a good place for a small leak to come from. I have also found no water on floor or other places. Just damp and have to be careful when I bring it in with snow on it as well or dead battery.

 

If you have a digital meter, put it on DC millivolts and in the key off circuit measure across each fuse under the engine and dash. Any circuit that does not have current flowing through it will show 0.00 millivolts. If a circuit has current flowing, it will show millivolts, the more current the higher the millivolts. This will help you narrow down the circuit that is not shutting off. It could be anywhere including current leakage across the ignition key. The start is narrowing it down to the circuit. My last one was corroded contacts in a power relay that kept partial power on the lighting circuits. Not enough to light the lights but enough to run the battery down. And dampness makes corrosion worse.

I did get new one from dealership and my problem would be like you had the key on and also did the switch as well. But did not hear of the relay one and do not know how it could have the radio and acc on. As that is the problem I have.

Tab57 See my post I just put up on finding sneak current draws.

 

Replying to post #30

When you bought the fuse box was it brand spanking new if not and all they did was wire brush the pins on the outside there could be corrosion inside the five layers if it was just taken out of a different truck. My wire brush cleaned all that up where you couldn’t even tell that there was corrosion but I kept going deeper and deeper finding more and more The deeper I went. So if you went to a Ford dealership and bought brand new that I wouldn’t worry about it but if you bought somebody else’s fuse box there’s a high chance that the corrosion could just be deeper inside. I know this sounds silly but if I was you I would go to a Ford dealership or order online the fender starter relay solenoid. I’ve been told that if those fail they can cause all sorts of random problems with Key on situations it’s been raining for two days now and I haven’t had any issues with the lights coming on I mean one of those two things completely fix my problem.

 

I did get new one from dealership and my problem would be like you had the key on and also did the switch as well. But did not hear of the relay one and do not know how it could have the radio and acc on. As that is the problem I have.

 

Glass shop can have that done in about an hour usually -- my guy comes out and does windows in the parking lot of our shop.

 

Very good point I will call someone

 

Tab57 See my post I just put up on finding sneak current draws.

The draw is only when it is damp inside cab and is fine even with rain and I do mean hard rain. If the inside air is dry all works like it should. Kind of strange but it is my luck. If it were not for bad luck would have none at all. But do get lucky when I need it most.

 

Have you checked your GEM?
Sounds like it's gotten wet and corrosion is not your friend.