Well well.....that would be nice!!

 

After reading over the 2020 Order Guide there's an issue here.

A) The Order Guide shows a 11, 400 lb (SRW) GWVR Package
B) The pictured order above shows 12,400 GVWR


Guess we will see what pans out. It's not in stone either way. I have seen Ford update the Order Guide in the past as they made some changes. Nothing says the order system is gospel either.

Adding to this topic the Order Guide shows a F250 Trailer Tow Package High Capacity that gives Increase GCW on diesel engine from 23,500 lbs. to 26,800 lbs.

Trucks usually curb weight in around 8,000-8,500lbs...Give that F250 that package pushes the GVWR to around 11, 300- 11,800. So that's more in line with an F-350 rating that has been a mainstay of 11,500lbs GVWR. I'll wait till the Tow Guide is out and trucks are hitting the lots to be reasonable.

 

This is to compete with GM. The new GM 2500 I believe are at 11500 gvwr and 3500 is 12400-12500.


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The 12,400 GVWR is a nice change (as I stated in the other thread with the order guide). I'd hope they'd also bump the RAWR to 7500# with the tires being the limiting factor @ 3750# each. I'm not a fan of DRW trucks and this could put the F350 SRW trucks back with the legal limits when towing a large 5th wheels (>15-17k). It's not hard to exceed the 7000 or 7240# current axle rating with a 3.5k pin weight. If they wanted to up it more, the LT285s are rated at 3860# each for a 7720# rating. The Tremor trim is the first time I've seen LT285s on a factory produced truck so we know it's out there for an option. Even more capacity with LT295s. I doubt we'd ever see those on a stock setup.

Edit: the tremor has LT285/75r18 w/ 129/126 load index = 4080# @ 80psi.....now we are talking!

 

That is a game changer. Been thinking dually, mainly because of high pin weight 5th wheel. Will have to wait and see some door stickers

 

I figure the State Fair of Texas will be when we find out power numbers. As well as towing and payload numbers. Sep 27 is the start of the fair.


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You were spot on with that guess.

They need to up the payload on the dually. All that rear tire capacity going to waste.


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They are limited by federal vehicle classing. Class 4 is limited to 14k GVWR and anything over requires commercial insurance and licensing. That’s why a 350 has higher payload than a 450 even though the 450 is a much more capable truck.

 

They need to up the payload on the dually. All that rear tire capacity going to waste.


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@Coops361:

They are limited by federal vehicle classing. Class 4 is limited to 14k GVWR and anything over requires commercial insurance and licensing.

Can you post your references for this info???

 

@Coops361:

They are limited by federal vehicle classing. Class 4 is limited to 14k GVWR and anything over requires commercial insurance and licensing.

Can you post your references for this info???

He’s right just pulled this off eBay 2010 king ranch F450

 

I'm going to need more than a door sticker picture that shows a FEDERAL vehicle classing specification and a requirement for CDL licensing and CDL insurance.



Post up a link to a Federal GOV site showing a direct vehicle classing specification, then include a Federal GOV link showing a CDL licensing and CDL insurance requirement.


CDL is ONLY for commercial drivers not private owners.

Class 4 is limited to 14k GVWR

This is WRONG from what I have found. A Class 4 vehicle classification requires the front and rear axles to be like 23' apart at a minimum. Pretty sure that's NOT a DRW truck. That identifies something more in line with a bus.


See here: https://www.fhwa.dot.gov/publications/research/infrastructure/pavements/ltpp/13091/002.cfm

 

More relevant: F-450 Limited

 

Remember the term Commercial is KEY. I don't see anywhere below where a F-450 being driven by a private citizen fits a CDL requirement in anyway by Federal standards.


I see a CDL requirement when operating in commercial/commerce AND towing.



From: https://www.fmcsa.dot.gov/registration/commercial-drivers-license/drivers




Classes of License and Commercial Learner's Permits (CLP)

Pursuant to Federal standards, States issue CDLs and CLPs to drivers according to the following license classifications:
Class A: Any combination of vehicles which has a gross combination weight rating or gross combination weight of 11,794 kilograms or more (26,001 pounds or more) whichever is greater, inclusive of a towed unit(s) with a gross vehicle weight rating or gross vehicle weight of more than 4,536 kilograms (10,000 pounds) whichever is greater.
Class B: Any single vehicle which has a gross vehicle weight rating or gross vehicle weight of 11,794 or more kilograms (26,001 pounds or more), or any such vehicle towing a vehicle with a gross vehicle weight rating or gross vehicle weight that does not exceed 4,536 kilograms (10,000 pounds).
Class C: Any single vehicle, or combination of vehicles, that does not meet the definition of Class A or Class B, but is either designed to transport 16 or more passengers, including the driver, or is transporting material that has been designated as hazardous under 49 U.S.C. 5103 and is required to be placarded under subpart F of 49 CFR Part 172 or is transporting any quantity of a material listed as a select agent or toxin in 42 CFR Part 73.

 

Commercial is the KEY.



Class A: Truck and trailer GCWR exceeding 26,001 lbs
Class B: Truck GVWR exceeds 26,001 lbs OR towed vehicle GVWR less than 10,000lbs
Class C: Transporting 16+ PAX, or hauling hazardous materials, etc etc as above.


Plenty of states DO NOT require anyone hauling their personal RV/equipment/etc etc to posses a CDL. TX is one state in particular that uses the term "non-CDL" when identifying different DLs. They break out a "class" assignment for "non-CDL" drivers as they do with with the class of CDL. Seems to be confusing to me but whatever it's TX.



CDL=Commercial or commerce. Acting in such a manner requires one to be getting PAID for the work of driving/hauling.


So when people get here saying there's some "federal requirement for XXX" I ask where are they getting their info.

In this discussion I was wanting to read the "federal vehicle classification" as @Coops361 has read so I'm on the same page or can make my own decision as to what it says.


I think @Fishsizzle quoted the wrong post.

 

Commercial is the KEY.



Class A: Truck and trailer GCWR exceeding 26,001 lbs
Class B: Truck GVWR exceeds 26,001 lbs OR towed vehicle GVWR less than 10,000lbs
Class 😄 Transporting 16+ PAX, or hauling hazardous materials, etc etc as above.


Plenty of states DO NOT require anyone hauling their personal RV/equipment/etc etc to posses a CDL. TX is one state in particular that uses the term "non-CDL" when identifying different DLs. They break out a "class" assignment for "non-CDL" drivers as they do with with the class of CDL. Seems to be confusing to me but whatever it's TX.



CDL=Commercial or commerce. Acting in such a manner requires one to be getting PAID for the work of driving/hauling.


So when people get here saying there's some "federal requirement for XXX" I ask where are they getting their info.

In this discussion I was wanting to read the "federal vehicle classification" as @Coops361 has read so I'm on the same page or can make my own decision as to what it says.


I think @Fishsizzle quoted the wrong post.

Huh?

Dude said he thought that 08-10 F450 had 14500 gcwr. Just found one that confirmed what he said. Go postal all you want. I had a commercial drivers lic for years. Drove semis up to 106,000

 

Ok so back to my question on the 2020+ trucks. I own a 2019 F450 and gvwr is 14,000, why are these newer trucks limited to 14,000 gvwr when the 6.4 450 was 14,500? Yes I know that these newer trucks have a higher gcwr but not sure on the lower gvwr, so any thoughts? That's why I was curious if big brother government stepped in and changed something different?