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Discussion Starter #1
H&S mini maxx
4" exhaust
Egr block off
5" exhaust tip
$1800 labor included?
What else do I need did? I have a 40' trailer I hotshot with & my gas mileage and power is whack! I need my truck did right!


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Cold air intake. And cold side intake pipe. And a aftermarket down pipe. Them will help keep egts lower when pulling


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Discussion Starter #3
Cold air intake. And cold side intake pipe. And a aftermarket down pipe. Them will help keep egts lower when pulling


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Thanks for the assistance I'll b checking on the price Monday!


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You could always do head studs. There expensive and labor would be up there too. But that would be piece of mind.


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Cold air intake. And cold side intake pipe. And a aftermarket down pipe. Them will help keep egts lower when pulling


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:agree:
You could also add the Elite 71 (or another turbo upgrade) to help keep the EGTs in check when towing. For me, it made a big difference in HP, it helped lower EGTs, and even added a little better fuel economy.

Of course, I would do studs before upgrading the fuel or turbo.
 

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Discussion Starter #6
You could always do head studs. There expensive and labor would be up there too. But that would be piece of mind.


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How much shud I expect to pay to do the head studs bc I thought in order to do that they would have to take off the cab!


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Discussion Starter #7
:agree:
You could also add the Elite 71 (or another turbo upgrade) to help keep the EGTs in check when towing. For me, it made a big difference in HP, it helped lower EGTs, and even added a little better fuel economy.

Of course, I would do studs before upgrading the fuel or turbo.
What all should I be getting done while the cab is off, it cost too much to take it on in off for all my up grades?


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900 for mini max
350 4 in dp back exhaust
60 tip
30 plates
tax bout 100
so looks like labor is about 360.

you have a lot of options since texas doesnt do emissions testing. if you dont have any warranty left id do a full exhaust, full egr delete and a cai.

if you want to save a few bucks theres a mini max and delete pipe on craigs for 850. install is easy.
 

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What all should I be getting done while the cab is off, it cost too much to take it on in off for all my up grades?


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Unfortunately, you are correct, it is almost always cab off. Depending on where in the country you are, studs (if you mill the heads, magna flux, etc.) is going to cost around $3500 when you add all the gaskets, fluids, and labor (if you can't do it yourself). That doesn't include any other mod, but to do studs, you have to remove the intake manny, exhaust manny, up pipes, turbos, etc. so it is a good time to do several mods. What you really need to do is decide on your budget and goals. Six months ago, I would have told you that I think a studs and a 71 were all you need to worry about (an exhaust manny and up pipes along and ported intake manny are nice bonuses too), but right now, the 6.4 aftermarket is exploding with new products. There are so many great builds going on right now for DD/towing guys, the answer is not so clear. Capt Dong is taking the air approach and doing the batmos. DesielFreak23 is currently doing one of the most unique builds I have seen to date (both stock turbo batmos, 30% nozzles, cam, valvetrain upgrade, intake manny, exhaust manny, and up pipes). I know another guy who just completed the HP batmo, a 71 batmo, exhaust manny and up pipes, and a WG which seems to be a good build. He just completed it so he hasn't got the bugs worked out (high EBPs), but it he says it spools very quick (which I would expect with batmos). Make no mistake, I am very happy with my build (intake manny, Elite 71, 6.0 exh manny and up pipes) and I wouldn't hesitate to recommend it to anyone (with studs), but maybe we will find out a cam on a relatively mild build is worth it. Or maybe we will find bigger nozzles with basically stock fuel running a shorter PW is the way to go for HP/efficiency. In summary, I still am an advocate of air first since it keeps the EGTs down. I personally love my 71 and based on indirect evidence (comparing different builds on different trucks so it is not an apples to apples comparison), I think the Elite 71 is the way to go over the batmo. That being said, I acknowledge that the batmos may be equal or possibly better. I know of only one direct comparison on the same truck (performed at Rudy's) of the Elite 71 vs. the batmo 71. On that truck with that programming, the Elite 71 did do around 15 HP higher than the 71 batmo. Of course, IMO, peak HP doesn't tell everything if you tow/DD. To me, the flatter HP curve, lower EGTs, quick spool up, and good BP/EBP ratio (1:1) in all circumstances except at WOT in the higer RPMs where I can see 50 PSI boost and 70 EBP si why I like it. There is a good chance the batmos might spool a little faster than mine so that has to be considered. Obviously, I am not knocking batmos...for $400, they are very reasonably priced mod which do seem to help spool up and EGTs. In summary, especially if you are going to do studs, take your time and research what's out there and decide based on your budget/goals. With all the different products/builds out there right now, you shouldn't have any trouble making a powerful, reliable DD.
 

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Discussion Starter #11
900 for mini max
350 4 in dp back exhaust
60 tip
30 plates
tax bout 100
so looks like labor is about 360.

you have a lot of options since texas doesnt do emissions testing. if you dont have any warranty left id do a full exhaust, full egr delete and a cai.

if you want to save a few bucks theres a mini max and delete pipe on craigs for 850. install is easy.
Thanks a lot for the sharing ur knowledge friend, I saw that turner & pipe on CL the other day I'll chech to c if it's still there!


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Discussion Starter #12
Unfortunately, you are correct, it is almost always cab off. Depending on where in the country you are, studs (if you mill the heads, magna flux, etc.) is going to cost around $3500 when you add all the gaskets, fluids, and labor (if you can't do it yourself). That doesn't include any other mod, but to do studs, you have to remove the intake manny, exhaust manny, up pipes, turbos, etc. so it is a good time to do several mods. What you really need to do is decide on your budget and goals. Six months ago, I would have told you that I think a studs and a 71 were all you need to worry about (an exhaust manny and up pipes along and ported intake manny are nice bonuses too), but right now, the 6.4 aftermarket is exploding with new products. There are so many great builds going on right now for DD/towing guys, the answer is not so clear. Capt Dong is taking the air approach and doing the batmos. DesielFreak23 is currently doing one of the most unique builds I have seen to date (both stock turbo batmos, 30% nozzles, cam, valvetrain upgrade, intake manny, exhaust manny, and up pipes). I know another guy who just completed the HP batmo, a 71 batmo, exhaust manny and up pipes, and a WG which seems to be a good build. He just completed it so he hasn't got the bugs worked out (high EBPs), but it he says it spools very quick (which I would expect with batmos). Make no mistake, I am very happy with my build (intake manny, Elite 71, 6.0 exh manny and up pipes) and I wouldn't hesitate to recommend it to anyone (with studs), but maybe we will find out a cam on a relatively mild build is worth it. Or maybe we will find bigger nozzles with basically stock fuel running a shorter PW is the way to go for HP/efficiency. In summary, I still am an advocate of air first since it keeps the EGTs down. I personally love my 71 and based on indirect evidence (comparing different builds on different trucks so it is not an apples to apples comparison), I think the Elite 71 is the way to go over the batmo. That being said, I acknowledge that the batmos may be equal or possibly better. I know of only one direct comparison on the same truck (performed at Rudy's) of the Elite 71 vs. the batmo 71. On that truck with that programming, the Elite 71 did do around 15 HP higher than the 71 batmo. Of course, IMO, peak HP doesn't tell everything if you tow/DD. To me, the flatter HP curve, lower EGTs, quick spool up, and good BP/EBP ratio (1:1) in all circumstances except at WOT in the higer RPMs where I can see 50 PSI boost and 70 EBP si why I like it. There is a good chance the batmos might spool a little faster than mine so that has to be considered. Obviously, I am not knocking batmos...for $400, they are very reasonably priced mod which do seem to help spool up and EGTs. In summary, especially if you are going to do studs, take your time and research what's out there and decide based on your budget/goals. With all the different products/builds out there right now, you shouldn't have any trouble making a powerful, reliable DD.
Wow you r the reason us beginners love these forums, you just taught me things that I've never even considered . I'll devise a plan and see who has the best prices for labor and come back and ask you guys if it's worth!


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08,

EGT's are goign to be your biggest issue. 1200* is the magic mark to stay below. Tune you 6.4 and put a 40ft trailer behind it you will very quickly see 1200*. Why is 1200* the magic number? aluminum begins to melt at 1200* F, pistons are an aluminum Alloy.

They guys down at PTP spec'd out a package for my F450 that includes Turbos, Intake, up pipes, manifolds and a new Torque converter. Since we're in there and moving more air we are goingto do the head studs too.

Operation Towing a 40 fter with how many #### on /in it? you will most likely be using the no power setting on the tuner, high power feeds fuel which makes heat in a big hurry. End result burnt pistons.

Towed a 24ft trailer 4200 miles this summer (8K#) runnign at 70mph and no power setting the EGTs w/o mods other than the deletes ran in the neighborhood of 1000*F add the headwind in the badlands, 1175*F on the flat! Crest the hills into Wy, 1200*F at 50mph.

I have 500hp available to the ground..... can't use it until I do some more work in the air and exhaust system.

Over all mileage 10.1, could have pushed that to 10.5 or 11 by slowing down to 65/65 but that is now 10 under the posted and worthy of a ticket....

Give Eric/Nate a ring and chat with them. They will not steer you wrong.
 

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H&S mini maxx
4" exhaust
Egr block off
5" exhaust tip
$1800 labor included?
What else do I need did? I have a 40' trailer I hotshot with & my gas mileage and power is whack! I need my truck did right!


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What is the end goal of the modifications?:dunno:

:popcorn::popcorn::popcorn:
 

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Discussion Starter #15
08,

EGT's are goign to be your biggest issue. 1200* is the magic mark to stay below. Tune you 6.4 and put a 40ft trailer behind it you will very quickly see 1200*. Why is 1200* the magic number? aluminum begins to melt at 1200* F, pistons are an aluminum Alloy.

They guys down at PTP spec'd out a package for my F450 that includes Turbos, Intake, up pipes, manifolds and a new Torque converter. Since we're in there and moving more air we are goingto do the head studs too.

Operation Towing a 40 fter with how many #### on /in it? you will most likely be using the no power setting on the tuner, high power feeds fuel which makes heat in a big hurry. End result burnt pistons.

Towed a 24ft trailer 4200 miles this summer (8K#) runnign at 70mph and no power setting the EGTs w/o mods other than the deletes ran in the neighborhood of 1000*F add the headwind in the badlands, 1175*F on the flat! Crest the hills into Wy, 1200*F at 50mph.

I have 500hp available to the ground..... can't use it until I do some more work in the air and exhaust system.

Over all mileage 10.1, could have pushed that to 10.5 or 11 by slowing down to 65/65 but that is now 10 under the posted and worthy of a ticket....

Give Eric/Nate a ring and chat with them. They will not steer you wrong.
Thanks for the info I'll definitely give them a call tell how I'm running my truck and get there options!


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Discussion Starter #16
What is the end goal of the modifications?:dunno:

:popcorn::popcorn::popcorn:
Don't have a goal I just know what I want, which is better mpg and more power to pull at times 28'000 pounds.


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Thanks for the info I'll definitely give them a call tell how I'm running my truck and get there options!


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Just for a comparison on why air flow is critical....I towed about 1000 miles over the late spring and early summer with the mods in my sig. I always tow on Mild on tunes that go up to 250 with low boost 1 (I hate the smoke on take off [especially with a manual tranny] so that is why it is so low). Most miles were Interstate in good ole WV (which means you are always on a hill). Temps were usually in the mid 80s to low 90s. I tow a dump trailer usually between 10-16k. It was very rare that I ever had to downshift and there are numerous hills at 6-7% grade for a couple of miles. Below 14k, I cant recall ever seeing higher than 1200. With over 14k, I could see in the mid 1200s in OD. If the hill was pretty long, I would downshift to 5th gear and they would drop to around 1000. I was always running 65-70 MPH. After 12k, my dump trailer is over its legal limits so I didn't speed. One time, my regular job had me tied up and I needed construction supplies for the weekend or I was going to be getting behind on a job so my wife towed just under 11k about 125 miles for me. Prior to that, her only experience towing was a jet ski with her Jeep. Disclaimer...my father-in-law did go with her in case she had trouble. I set the defuel at 1250 and she never hit it. Prior to ported intake manny, the 71, and exhaust manny with up pipes, there is no way in h#ll, I would have let her tow that much!!!

I agree that is smart to keep try to keep the EGTs below 1200, but I think you safely go above those temps for a little while. I never plan to sell my truck so I do try to keep them below 1250, but from the factory, when your truck regens, they are between 1300 and 1400. I think the factory defuel is 1350. I wouldn't want to be at 1350 for over 10-15 minutes at a time, but these engines were built to handle the heat pretty well. The biggest thing that would concern me at those temps is if you have a stock intake manny, because they flow about 20% less to the back cylinders, your EGTs may get pretty hot in the back cylinders and lead to a cracked piston. For example, if your EGTs say 1250, the exhaust gas coming from the back cylinders might be 1400 or more. I thought the combustion temps were around 2k (but I could be wrong) and because of this extreme heat during combustion by the time it reaches the EGT sensor, it is down 1200. For someone like MD05 who tows a sh#t load of miles, I definitely think it would be smart to try to keep them below 1200-1250, but if you only tow a few hundred miles per year, you will probably be safe if you to have to exceed 1200 for a little while.

BTW Have fun with 28k. I did one tow of 26k in the mountains for about 70 miles with a trailer that had really good breaks and it was white knuckle experience. Climbing the mountains, I was running slow and still fighting EGTs and going down the mountains was one of the most nerve racking things I have ever done. Even with the trailer brakes as good as they were, that thing pushed the h#ll out of my truck. When I was on flat ground, it wasn't too bad. Needless to say, I was thrilled when that tow was over (a JD 450 dozer on a tri-axle trailer).
 

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08,

EGT's are goign to be your biggest issue. 1200* is the magic mark to stay below. Tune you 6.4 and put a 40ft trailer behind it you will very quickly see 1200*. Why is 1200* the magic number? aluminum begins to melt at 1200* F, pistons are an aluminum Alloy.

They guys down at PTP spec'd out a package for my F450 that includes Turbos, Intake, up pipes, manifolds and a new Torque converter. Since we're in there and moving more air we are goingto do the head studs too.

Operation Towing a 40 fter with how many #### on /in it? you will most likely be using the no power setting on the tuner, high power feeds fuel which makes heat in a big hurry. End result burnt pistons.

Towed a 24ft trailer 4200 miles this summer (8K#) runnign at 70mph and no power setting the EGTs w/o mods other than the deletes ran in the neighborhood of 1000*F add the headwind in the badlands, 1175*F on the flat! Crest the hills into Wy, 1200*F at 50mph.

I have 500hp available to the ground..... can't use it until I do some more work in the air and exhaust system.

Over all mileage 10.1, could have pushed that to 10.5 or 11 by slowing down to 65/65 but that is now 10 under the posted and worthy of a ticket....

Give Eric/Nate a ring and chat with them. They will not steer you wrong.
I went through Holderdown and Elite for my parts and was very pleased with the service and parts. I have also heard many good things about PTP. What specifically did they recommend for your build?
 

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Eric of PTP recommended the following:

-Full EGR delete
-GOGO stage 1 intake
-Industrial Injection Phat saft moded factory turbos
-Steed Speed manifolds and up pipes
-Suncoast Torque Converter
-ARP head studs

My other issue is the trans programing ( Wish I had a ZF 6-650) just got the H&S MCC tunning program and currently messing with it to try to get the trans to think better. It will take some time to get that right. Also going to look at the engine tuning to see if I ro a tuner can make it more efficent ( Less Smoke) Eric suggested Innovative Diesel (in my neck of the wood) for tuning.

I put 25K# behind my rig a time or two.... all I can say is 28K# on a 350 for any lenght of time..... other than a short hop is not in my cards. I know a lot of folks do it and say they have no problems... I don't buy it. I had to move some farm equipment for a friend yes I could get down the road, but down hill was an expirence I would like to avoid at all costs. I need to toggle PTP and see if an exhaust brake can be installed on a delete 6.4 motor without screwing up the turbos or tuning....

I is really amazing how fast you gather speed coming down hill with a big load behind...
 
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