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International Threat
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Discussion Starter #1
I plan to make my own here soon for my truck and I just wanted to know what the idea behind the length of the bar was and how long it should be.

This is going to be on a stock suspensioned truck and I know that tire size does not matter at this point, but they're only 285's. It'll be on a crewcab short bed truck w/ a w/b of 156" but I don't think that matters.

I basically want someone to tell me how long the bar should be, and why...



(The Green part). Like my MS Paint drawing at work? :hehe:

Patrick? I know we've spoke about this... but never delved into the length needed.
 

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I have mine built so that at no suspension level (unloaded or fully loaded on the bumpers) they do not torque the pinion angle. The geometry took more time to figure out than the actual fabrication. The angle exactly matches that of the drive shaft at any load. I made my loops mount to them. I can remove them in five minutes. I have run them on the street for 30,000 miles with no problems. They make it feel totally different when you get on it, no rear end spring deflection at all.
I had them off for a while and took off too quick with my trailer, BAD DEAL. Since then they have stayed on.

If you are interested I could send you pictures of the setup. They are also very light, not over 30 extra pounds. Not over $150.00 in them.
 

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Rice Hunter
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I take it that your are experiencing some wheel hop with that go-pedal depressed Marty?::woot:
I see that you have that monster back on the road.
Sorry dude,,,,,,I've missed 2 weeks off the org and still catching up!
Glad that money tree is still producing:hehe:
 

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International Threat
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Discussion Starter #4
The angle exactly matches that of the drive shaft at any load.
This is what I wanted to hear... I figured it had to do with the axle dropp and up travel...

I take it that your are experiencing some wheel hop with that go-pedal depressed Marty?::woot:
Glad that money tree is still producing:hehe:

Not so much, but I'm putting limiting straps on the front and traction bars on the rear to help me on the track... both the sled track and the race track. And if the money tree was still producing I'd be buying new ones, not making them :hehe:
 

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duct tape & zip ties
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From my experince you will want the bar to mount to the axle centered on the tube. Right now your drawing shows it on the bottom of the axle tube.

As for length the ones I see on trucks by me are about 48 inches long. They are a double bar design meaning they have two bars mounting to the axle but only one mounting point at the frame. Making them look like ladders. Hence the reason why they are called ladder bars.

As for your drawing I would go with that set up just move the mounting point on the axle to the front center of the axle tube. Basically so your mounting point is at 9pm.
 

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bigcountrysg- For traction bars,..it is normally attached at the 6:30 position,....if he mounts it where you are suggesting,...it will zero effect in prevent axle wrap.

the length you will need is 7'1" for proper arch when the springs compress.


Maintain...if you want some REALLY good quality bars....with HEIM joints,..and all the proper grade 8 hardware....at a ridiculously good price...PM me.
 

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International Threat
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Discussion Starter #7
From my experince you will want the bar to mount to the axle centered on the tube.
I don't see how that would help with axle wrap? :confused: It would keep the axle from coming forward, but that's not really the problem since it's afixed to the springs....

They are a double bar design meaning they have two bars mounting to the axle but only one mounting point at the frame. Making them look like ladders. Hence the reason why they are called ladder bars.
Yeah, I believe the ladderbar style is more effective, but I don't really have a problem now, figured adding another 70 hp though is going to make it one though. Also, the single bar is simpler...

the length you will need is 7'1" for proper arch when the springs compress.
Ok, great - why though?
 

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Sparkplugs Not Required
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bigcountrysg- For traction bars,..it is normally attached at the 6:30 position,....if he mounts it where you are suggesting,...it will zero effect in prevent axle wrap.

the length you will need is 7'1" for proper arch when the springs compress.


Maintain...if you want some REALLY good quality bars....with HEIM joints,..and all the proper grade 8 hardware....at a ridiculously good price...PM me.
+1 for Tank's mounting position.......If you mount at 9:00 you will have no effect in preventing axle wrap.
 

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duct tape & zip ties
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10,761 Posts
bigcountrysg- For traction bars,..it is normally attached at the 6:30 position,....if he mounts it where you are suggesting,...it will zero effect in prevent axle wrap.

the length you will need is 7'1" for proper arch when the springs compress.


Maintain...if you want some REALLY good quality bars....with HEIM joints,..and all the proper grade 8 hardware....at a ridiculously good price...PM me.
When I make them I make the double bar style. So when they mount they mount centered on the axle tube at 9pm. But the bars are at the top and bottom of the axle tube.
 

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International Threat
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Discussion Starter #11
The only thing I can think Big is meaning is this...



 

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duct tape & zip ties
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bigcountrysg - I'm not "seeing" what you mean...I can't picture it in my head.

I was responding to what he was building..and the pic he posted.

And with a single bar design,...the ONLY spot to attach it to the axle...is between 6:15 and 6:45 ..to be effective.


Here is a "good read" on traction bar systems..

Google Image Result for http://www.4x4wire.com/jeep/tech/susp/axlewrap/soa4.gif


I build ladder bars. Because I have seen single traction bars buckle. If you look at a normal ladder bar mount there is a mount at 225 degrees and at 315 degrees. The degree measurement is when 360 degrees would be at 12 o'clock on the axle tube. This would have the center point of the ladder bars at 270 degrees centered on the axle. I wish I could draw it out in paint like Maintain. But I am not that good. But when I get home I will draw it out and scan it and post it. Once you see the picture you will understand what I am saying.
 

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ok...your talking about ladder bars...he was asking about traction bars.


ladder bars have a different effect on vehicles, they tend to lift the front up a little...

I fell traction bars reduce axle wrap a little better.



 

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duct tape & zip ties
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ok...your talking about ladder bars...he was asking about traction bars.


ladder bars have a different effect on vehicles, they tend to lift the front up a little...

I fell traction bars reduce axle wrap a little better.



In the picture if you bring that bottom bar to the front of the axle and place it halfway between 6oclock and 7 oclock that would look like the setups I make. Rather then having that bottom bar mount to the backside of the axle.
 

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what is the diff. between a ladder bad and a traction bar?
 

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duct tape & zip ties
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what is the diff. between a ladder bad and a traction bar?
Force Applied to the Frame. Ladder bars put an upward force on the frame. Traction bars put a forward force on the frame.
 

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ah yes... i didnt get the pics until you said that.... ha wow i need some sleep!
 

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I get the pics now... which works better? They are both used to reduce axle wrap from hard acceleration with high hp and tq, or larger tires, or off road conditions? Right? Which version should be used for what application?
 
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