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Dont DO THIS then:poke:




I did not SEARCH for this thread... It popped up in the "active topics" section and I said what I KNOW!

This man has been researching and workin on it when fuel prices were low so don't try to pull the "high fuel prices crap on me" :blahblah1:




If you want to be a :tard: and live in your own little world then fine by me:thumb:


But don't pull everyone else into your craphole:buttkick:




I said all that I KNOW and it is not an opinion...it is a FACT!!!


I Also said that it is NOT for the average guy... It costs around 10k but comes with a lifetime warrenty.. It is ONLY worth it for the semi trucks and Hot-shot rigs IMO...


It does require specific tuning and is VERY complicated work... THAT is why the average joe can't just "build" one at home... It needs TUNING to respond correctly.
 

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Oh God, let's NOT DO THIS!!!

Take this Snake Oil out of here and close this thread before it attracts more Zealots who are dieing to preach this Nonsense.

The "Open Minds" we all had 3 yrs ago have been satisfied....

This is Bull$hit any way you slice it, it doesn't work, not worth the effort, and everybody should realize by now,,, there is simply no less reliable source for information that the hobbyist who's found his magic elixir and get's the results he expects to get ;)

IF it worked, why didn't anybody continue to do it after fuel prices dropped last time???

Please let's no go around and around again, I'm sure there are no shortages of those (like this interloper dudadiesel with his "cause") who are just sure they got significant results. Great for you, P.T.Barnum would have Loved you all.... :wink[3]:
Hey I am seriously trying to find an answer to this. I had explored it back in 2007/2008 but never attempted anything until around this past summer before any fuel spike. Again, I am trying to set this straight so I know what information to pass onto others, so far I've just seen bickering back and forth of it works and no it does. I did finish my tank and fill today and found no gains. So again playing with the mods, trying different things, to see if it's the Ford or if the HHO is BS. I can see where there's potential marketing and I can see where there's a lot of doubt. If I can't get it to work on my truck, which many claim the Ford is a tough one, I'll need to find another vehicle I suppose to verify. If I get two failures, I will be a lot happier. I just can't see how there can be so many people selling junk that doesn't work and people who actually throw it on and believe it works. Then again, maybe everyone who has one says it works because it's a marketing scam? How I wish someone had some real data.
 

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So hilarious story. When everyone here started screaming scam scam scam I went and looked around a bit, found a nice youtube video that marks it as a scam. And something about them showing the tests they did to prove it didnt work, and what a surprise, the big face on the video was the very guy that taught the class I was in back in 2008/2009 whenever it was. Suddenly I rememebred a lot of the BS things the guy was trying to send as a sales pitch such as a perpetual run machine powered by magnets, the kind of BS that makes an engineer laugh at the guy--and I was then.

Somehow the HHO still stuck in my head as something that might possibly work and all the other garbage he was pushing wasn't impressive. The real fault is that the guy who dragged me to the class had built an HHO generator and said he got gains until it broke (home made) so it has been stuck in my head that it does work. But I have been testing myself and absolutely no gains, with the typical response from the makers of these things that it's all about the electronics and Ford's are tricky. Which is why I'm here: To get opinions. And I think I'm very leaning towards it being all a scam, but I want to read more and get any other opinions which may be out there. I'll finish reading this whole thread too, as apparently a solution must have been found in the middle that I skipped ;)
 

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IF it worked, why didn't anybody continue to do it after fuel prices dropped last time???
If it worked, it would be on every vehicle out there regardless of fuel cost. :nod:
 

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If it worked, it would be on every vehicle out there regardless of fuel cost. :nod:
A few reasons. One being the annoying maintenance and traditionally dangerous chemicals. Plus they break down in a year and need replacement, so they could cost more than they save. But overall, yeah. You'd think there'd be huge reputable companies by now digging into this.

One of the most annoying parts of this is the idiots claiming their vehicle runs entirely on the stuff, which is definitely false. 2nd law of thermo proves that wrong. And then you got the guys talking about how they are idiots and the real thing is only fuel savings due to better combustion.
 

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If it worked, it would be on every vehicle out there regardless of fuel cost. :nod:
They have diesel ranger's and cars that get terrific mileage. Not every vehicle, and not here with our fuel prices.
And it works over there . . .

My Samsung SGH-I997 made me send this.
 

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It's BS, as there's no such thing as HHO. Hydrogen can only bond to Oxygen in 1 way, which we call H2O. Yes, you can have H2, and O2, and in fact that's what you get with electrolysis of water. In our mpg calculation, we also need to factor in the amount of H2 we're using as fuel too.

So the power to split water comes from electricity, which is made by the alternator, which is.. powered by the engine. The only reason this works since we don't have a perpetual motion machine is by adding an actual fuel. You cannot get more energy out than you put in. Now you can split steam into it's components with less electricity required than you put in, provided the steam is at some very high temp, like 600 degrees in which case it can pull some of the needed energy from the heat. Of course, now you need to heat the water to a very high temp which requires, energy. Again, we can't break the laws of thermodynamics.

But wait you say, diesel has xxx BTU's of energy per gallon, and it should only take yyy BTU's of energy to go a mile down the road. That's an efficiency of zz percent! My fuel-o-matic isn't a perpetual motion machine, it just increases the efficiency!

In a diesel, it's easy to tell if you're completely burning the fuel. If you are, then you don't have black smoke coming from the tailpipe. Diesel is a hydrocarbon fuel, typically C12H23. So 2x C12H23 molecules are first combined with O2 from the atmosphere to produce 2x C12, 23x H2O. If the reaction is allowed to continue, the carbon will then react with the oxygen to produce 24x CO2. If we don't have an even number of hydrogen atoms in our reaction, they will combine with the nitrogen in the air or some of sulfur in the fuel and that's the smog or particulate emissions we get.
So we're already burning all of our fuel, and the flame speed doesn't matter because we burn up all of the hydrogen first anyways.
But what about our efficiency? There's a lot of friction in the engine, from things like your piston rings that keep your combustion out of the crankcase, to all of the small things since bearings aren't friction free either. Plus the engine has to power other things, like the alternator, the HPOP, the fan, power steering pump, etc. Even after all of that, there's still wasted energy. Where did it go? It's heat! And most of it is escaping through your tailpipe! How can I use it? Stick a turbo on the exhaust! Oh wait.. Ford did that for us. :)

In the engine world, a turbo is the closest thing to a free lunch there is. You're using normally wasted energy to do some useful work. Sure, there is a penalty as the exhaust can't flow away from the engine as well, but it can recover more in wasted energy than is used to run it. It's not perpetual energy, you're only recovering some of the otherwise wasted energy.

You could stick themoelectric junctions (peltier coolers) on the exhaust and use the temperature differential between the exhaust and the atmosphere to directly generate electricity, but they aren't very efficient which is why they aren't found on cars today.

So for more reading and some math to back this up:
Scientific proof proving that HHO scams are a fraud

more on hydrogen as a fuel:
Hydrogen as a Fuel for Automobiles and Other Vehicles

I don't work for big (or any) oil. As a recreational pilot staring at $5-6 / gallon fuel prices feeding an engine that runs around 80% power for the duration of a flight, I certainly do hope there is a way to use what we have more efficiently.
 

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The actual energy contained in one hydrogen atom is enormous. Remember the Hydrogen Bomb pioneered by the Soviets? I'm sure that you can get more energy out than you put in, but the question is, do we have the technology to do so now?
We wouldn't be fissioning hydrogen in our engines. we would be burning it. And look up the first law of thermodynamics. energy in=energy out always. (just not in the desired form)
 

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We wouldn't be fissioning hydrogen in our engines. we would be burning it. And look up the first law of thermodynamics. energy in=energy out always. (just not in the desired form)
Yup. Their argument that it helps our current fuel burn more efficiently is what got me. But I've done months of testing and have only losses to show (energy efficiency loss through alternator to convert water to hydrogen) so unless it's specifically my truck, it doesn't work. I've already taken it off.
 

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Yup. Their argument that it helps our current fuel burn more efficiently is what got me. But I've done months of testing and have only losses to show (energy efficiency loss through alternator to convert water to hydrogen) so unless it's specifically my truck, it doesn't work. I've already taken it off.
After a lot of research there are a few things I have learned:

1- you can't run more than 20 amps through it because after 20 amps you are defeating the system unless you have a really big alt. (I have a 210 amp ambulance one on mine)

2- You will need 3 -4 lpm for a 6.0 motor to do any good which means you will need at least 30 amps and a big alt. You can also add a deep cell battery to just run the system with good results. Hooking up 2 smaller plate cells is better than 1 large one.

3- You will need a Pulse Width Modulator to control the amps.

4- You will also need a EFIE for YOUR HHO system so your truck doesn't push more fuel when it gets more oxygen.

If you don't do it right don't waste your time or money. There are people running cars and trucks on pure HHo and it's been proven to work. It's not a magic bullet and everything has to be right in order to see any good results.

When my system is in I will post my findings....
 

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After a lot of research there are a few things I have learned:

1- you can't run more than 20 amps through it because after 20 amps you are defeating the system unless you have a really big alt. (I have a 210 amp ambulance one on mine)

2- You will need 3 -4 lpm for a 6.0 motor to do any good which means you will need at least 30 amps and a big alt. You can also add a deep cell battery to just run the system with good results. Hooking up 2 smaller plate cells is better than 1 large one.

3- You will need a Pulse Width Modulator to control the amps.

4- You will also need a EFIE for YOUR HHO system so your truck doesn't push more fuel when it gets more oxygen.

If you don't do it right don't waste your time or money. There are people running cars and trucks on pure HHo and it's been proven to work. It's not a magic bullet and everything has to be right in order to see any good results.

When my system is in I will post my findings....
The only way to run purely on HHO is to store it after producing from a different power source than your alternator and then use it later on the vehicle. If you think you're going to run your vehicle on just HHO from use of the alternator, you haven't a clue about anything going on here.
 

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The Hydrogen generators do work, your adding a trace amount of pure Hydrogen and Oxygen radicals to your air intake

It improves fuel combustion efficiency, reduces emissions, .. Max improvement 20%

HOWEVER! modern engine electronics are not set up to optimize for Hydrogen being added to air mix, so your improvement will probably be much much less

Why don't major manufactures do it?

hydrogen embrittlement!

You need a stainless steel combustion chamber, or you better be using a cheap disposable engine

The hydrogen generators can explode! (and they do!)
beware!!
 

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Methane helps HHO

As long as we are at it.....
I heard of a guy who heard of a guy who built an HHO system with a twist. He added a second "hollow" generator that he filled with dog poo, which would produce methane,among other things, upon decomposition which was mixed with the the HHO. Although the guy produced absolutely no independent engineering data to support it, he swears the methane addition added a minimum 3 mpg, hand calculated, to every vehicle upon which the methane digestor was installed in tandem with the HHO generator.The guy even linked to some ebay listings for his dog poo tube to show he was for real.

Anecdotal evidence from those adding the load of crap to their trucks and not achieving the mpg gains was dismissed as caused by a failure to understand (and tune for, in some unspecified way) the highly complex, idiosyncratic, and downright finicky aspects of the 7.3 as it relates to the complex and hard to understand interactions among diesel, water vapor, hydrogen, oxygen,methane, and last, but not least, the vapors coming off a load of crap.

Pax
 

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As long as we are at it.....
I heard of a guy who heard of a guy who built an HHO system with a twist. He added a second "hollow" generator that he filled with dog poo, which would produce methane,among other things, upon decomposition which was mixed with the the HHO. Although the guy produced absolutely no independent engineering data to support it, he swears the methane addition added a minimum 3 mpg, hand calculated, to every vehicle upon which the methane digestor was installed in tandem with the HHO generator.The guy even linked to some ebay listings for his dog poo tube to show he was for real.

Anecdotal evidence from those adding the load of crap to their trucks and not achieving the mpg gains was dismissed as caused by a failure to understand (and tune for, in some unspecified way) the highly complex, idiosyncratic, and downright finicky aspects of the 7.3 as it relates to the complex and hard to understand interactions among diesel, water vapor, hydrogen, oxygen,methane, and last, but not least, the vapors coming off a load of crap.

Pax
:clap: :clap:
 

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As long as we are at it.....
I heard of a guy who heard of a guy who built an HHO system with a twist. He added a second "hollow" generator that he filled with dog poo, which would produce methane,among other things, upon decomposition which was mixed with the the HHO. Although the guy produced absolutely no independent engineering data to support it, he swears the methane addition added a minimum 3 mpg, hand calculated, to every vehicle upon which the methane digestor was installed in tandem with the HHO generator.The guy even linked to some ebay listings for his dog poo tube to show he was for real.

Anecdotal evidence from those adding the load of crap to their trucks and not achieving the mpg gains was dismissed as caused by a failure to understand (and tune for, in some unspecified way) the highly complex, idiosyncratic, and downright finicky aspects of the 7.3 as it relates to the complex and hard to understand interactions among diesel, water vapor, hydrogen, oxygen,methane, and last, but not least, the vapors coming off a load of crap.

Pax
Now that's pure genius!:thumb:

Where can I get one? My dog died last year but I'm sure my neighbors will gladly give me all their dog crap for free. Maybe they'll even pay me to take it away, cutting my fuel costs down even more!!
 
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