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Exact HP Gains

4825 Views 33 Replies 8 Participants Last post by  j_b623
Hello all. I’ve been doing hours and hours of research and I can’t find an exact answer to mg questions, so I figured I’d post it up and see what you all think. First of all, I’ve got a project truck. 2001 F-250 7.3 Automatic Extended cab short bed. After I’m done with the reliability and drivability issued, I’m going to start with performance upgrades. Now with this truck being a 2001, it’s got the PMR. I’ve heard these are good to 400 hp? Does this sound correct? Also, I assume this value is measured at the flywheel? Second, I’m going to do heavy towing. I’m looking to do Stage 1 180cc single shots from full force diesel. Maybe a T500 or adrenaline. Probably a PowerMax from Garret. Along with all this the obvious intake, exhaust, gauges. And finally. A custom tune. I’m planning to go with my SCT 7015 X4 to program with, but I don’t know whose tunes would fit my truck the best assuming I go with the build I mentioned earlier. With these upgrades, what horsepower would I be looking at? Would I be in danger of blowing the rods? Also, the transmission is freshly rebuilt, but when it goes I’ll either do a BTS or ZF6 swap when the time comes so I’m not worried about that much. I’m not planning to drag race this truck. I’ll be using it as a DD, heavy hauler, and a truck I can use for fun with the wife. I’m looking for excellent power, but I’m not looking to do a rebuild in the near future. Thanks for any comments.
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I have powdered rods in my truck. Personally what I would do is 160/30 injectors, a 63/68 turbo from KC, and a built trans (Sam Wyse, BTS, & John Woods are the top 3 to choose from) with a larger trans cooler. Of course proper gauges as well. With those injectors you can skip the T500 HPOP. That should get you to around 400hp at the wheels with a good tune

As far as tuning, skip the SCT and get a Hydra chip with custom tunes from Jelibuilt Performance. Brian will hook you up with whatever tunes you need. Let him know that you have powdered rods, and he will write tunes accordingly to keep the engine safe.
I have a daily driver, tow, and various performance/race tunes

The hydra will give you a huge advantage if you’re looking to tow because you can switch tunes on the fly. You can run a hotter tune to have fun with when unloaded, and then quickly switch to a tow tune when you hook up your trailer. This is a much better setup than trying to get a blanket tune on your SCT to use for everything; you’ll actually have specific tunes for whatever you’re doing

P.S. there is a chance you have forged rods. Do a search on YouTube to figure out how to check. It involves taking a plug out of the block near the oil filter & looking for either a rod cap bolt or a stud and nut. Bolts = powdered, stud and nut = forged
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Where do you recommend the injector and turbo purchase? The 31 row trans cooler is on the list, I already have a CTS2 to install on it. The reason I was going to use the SCT is because I have it from my 6.0. But I do understand now why everyone says hydra. I used to have a TS 6 Pos on my 2000.the best thing ever r was shift on the fly. If I skip the T500 though, there’s my finances to pay for the Hydra. I like this setup that you recommend. It looks like the KC300X 63/68 can be had from RiffRaff for a fair price. I just don’t know where to look for the injectors. Also what brand do you recommend? The build date on the truck is 04-01 so I assume I have the PMR, but I’ll check to see on the serial number break. That may be easier than pulling the plug? When the rebuilt trans goes, I will choose whether or not to do the manual swap. It would honestly be a little cheaper to do the manual, but I would be using a used transmission, so that may sway me to go with the auto. 400 hp seems like a number I’m comfortable with but the trans possibly wouldn’t be. Could I expect a transmission replacement in the near future given I make these upgrades?
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I got my turbo directly from KC. My injectors are built by Full Force Diesel, but I got them through Brian at Jelibuilt Performance. He’s a vendor for Full Force. He offered 6 free custom tunes of your choice for a Hydra chip if you purchase the injectors through him, which was a $200+ value. Not sure if he still offers that deal or not

As far as trans goes, it’s up to you whether you wanna go manual or not. I got a Sam Wyse stage 1 4r100 directly from him. With that and the Mishimoto 6.0 cooler my total cost was around $4k. It’s a fantastic transmission, with the pump & valve body mods coupled with Brian’s tuning, the shifting is amazing

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Tagging in @CloverLeafFarm, he loves this stuff.
Also john woods is not more... There were supply issues and then he was helping a few on the side but he was backed up. Sad to see it gone but another one bites the dust...
Call tuners and specify exactly
Truck purpose
hp goal
then listen to their advice for turbo/injector advice
if trans is a stock rebuild then upgrade that 1st
then take said advice and go with turbo/injector combo
I appreciate everyone’s replies. They are very helpful. Clover leaf are you saying I can upgrade just 1st gear and get away with it? It is a stock rebuild.
Looks like the Jellibuilt tunes are excellent. Good reviews as well. What tunes are you running 7.3_TurboDiesel? It looks like I can get basically everything I need from Jellibuilt and Full Force. Also may be a dumb question, but does anybody install split shots in our trucks after removing the originals? I see everyone going for single shots for the performance.
He meant upgrade the transmission first before adding power, nothing to do with 1st gear specifically. I’m running Jelibuilt tunes on my truck. Single shots are your only option for larger than stock injectors

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Okay yeah I see where I read that completely wrong. I thought that would be kind of odd. Okay I’ll figure out what I want to do transmission wise. I wonder if a rebuilt transmission with around 5,000 miles is worth anything. Maybe I could find someone wanting to do a manual to auto swap. That would be preferable. Can the manual trans handle the horsepower as long as I install a south bend or other heavy duty clutch?
Yeah the manual trans can take power with a stronger clutch. I’m not sure of the exact number but I know guys personally who have run 450-500hp through one without issue. Keep in mind you will have a core charge on your trans if you opt for a new built auto. I believe it was $800 when I got mine a couple years ago. So it’s only worth selling your current trans privately if you can get more than that

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be cheaper/quicker to just have your 4R built to 450 hp.
probably cost $4,000-$5,000 give or take. don't know what current prices are for 4R stuff.
My last 4R i built was probably 10-12 years ago for 650-700 hp cost about $5,500
Well from what i understand, or at least a few years ago, if you bought a BTS and trashed it, he’d send you a new one at no charge. I can get everything I need for the manual swap for just over 3K. This one will be a hard decision. Building the trans I have would be nice though because it is newly rebuilt. I’m going to look into my options and see if there’s anyone around my area that would be able to build up a trans. I can do whatever I need to with an engine, but I’ve only rebuilt two transmissions and they were both out of articulated 4WD tractors. But I also had a service manual then.
Make sure you drive a 7.3 with a manual trans before going to all that trouble. They aren’t a fun little quick shifting manual car, they drive more like a semi truck. Your truck now being stock with an auto would still toast your truck if you manual swapped it & added all the performance stuff in a drag race

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I don’t plan to drag race it, but I do know the 97 my uncle had with the ZF5 was the best truck I’ve ever drove. I would love to have another one, but this truck I will use to pull heavy loads, which is why I think I’d like the manual over the auto. Plus I like the control and the manual gear in my 15. When you get to choose your gear, I feel like you’re more in control over your truck and the load behind it.
So I learned a bit more information about the truck. It’s been sitting since January of 16, which I was the last to work on it (that’s a really long story), but now it’s finally mine. I went through some of the paperwork on its repairs a few years prior to it sitting. It’s got new injectors, a new HPOP, and a new, not rebuilt transmission in it. This changes things. I was thinking the injectors and HPOP were original. However, the turbo for sure is. The up pipes are shot, and the pedestal appears to be leaking from the actuator as we’ve all seen it before. So my next question is this, if I keep the stock injectors for now, would I benefit any from going to the KC300X 63/68? I understand that the HP is a direct relation to the injectors, but that’s only half the ball game. If I keep the new injectors, upgrade the turbo, pedestal, and up pipes, and then wait until these injectors go, would that be money well spent? I’m going with the Hydra for sure, adding intake, exhaust, bellowed up pipes, deleted pedestal, and all that. If you don’t recommend the KC turbo I mentioned earlier with the stocks, should I modify my stock turbo instead, or should I look towards upgrading turbos, but just not the KC I mentioned? I had a WW and a TS chip on my 2000 and I thought that was pretty awesome. But I always felt a little hungry for more when I was towing 18K plus. Like I mentioned, I’ll tow heavy with it at times, but I want it to be quick too. I’ve decided to go with the auto instead of the swap because the wife will drive this truck. She does know how and does well at driving a manual, she just prefers the auto inside the city where we live which is understandable. Any thoughts? Clover leaf I see you always commenting that the garret 38r is the best drop in turbo stock-550hp, but most of the posts are several years back. Is this still your recommendation with stock injectors?
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If you’re sticking with stock injectors I’d put KCs balanced assembly in your stock turbo & call it a day. It’s much cheaper than the 63/68 and will help you control egts & surging while towing. The 63/68 is a little bit oversized for stock injectors, but I’m sure it would run ok. Just not worth the extra money if you’re staying stock in my opinion.

I don’t think there’s such thing as a “new” 4r100 anymore. They’re all rebuilt. Can you get any more info on where it came from? I guess if you’re staying relatively close to stock power levels the transmission isn’t as much of a concern. Definitely still would install the Mishimoto cooler though

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It looks like the balanced assembly would be better than what I had in my 2000 which was just stock with a WW, so I’m hoping the assembly will be a nice upgrade from that as far as boost numbers and power. Plus the cost is so much easier to deal with. Plus I’ll be going with the Hydra and Jellibuilt tunes. So that’s a plus as well.
The trans was new in 2012 when replaced @ 110,00 miles is what the paper says. That’s knly 10,000 miles less than it has now. If I remember right, the rebuild was $2800 w/1year warranty and the new one was around $4000 w/3 year warranty. I could be way off but I remember when we replaced it we talked about the price versus warranty situation.
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I have everything you are looking for on the shelf except for the transmission. KC balanced assembly, injectors, Hydra chip with Jelibuilt tuning, up pipes, intake, exhaust, etc.

We do this sorta thing every day.

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I’ve been waiting for you to reply to this post because I have a lot of questions for you but I didn’t want to call on the weekend so I’ll ask them here for others to see if they are wondering the same thing. Obviously I’m going with the stock injectors. If I upgrade to a 70 psi fuel spring, upgrade to the bigger banjo bolts, and install a fuel crossover, would that be enough fuel to warrant a stock plus KC? And another question I have is, for only $100 more, why would one prefer the stock plus over the 63/68 if both can be sustained with stock injectors? I plan going 6637 intake, hydra with Jellibuilt custom tunes not canned, 4” MBRP turbo back w/muffler delete, and the other thing I’m trying to decide on is what to do with the turbo. I’m going with the bigger banjos and the 70 psi spring for sure. I thought about going with the Gillett diesel spring which is rated for 90-110 which usually reads around 95, but I’m not sure if that’s too high or not. I had one on my 2000 that I installed, ran it for about a week and then blew the steel return line from the back of the passenger side head to the fuel bowl. Had to change that in the rain, luckily the closest Ford dealer had one in stock. Couldn’t believe that. At the time the truck had around 260k so I’m not sure if it was just from it being old, because it blew right where the clamp holds it, or if it was the spring that made it blow. Or perhaps a combination of both. A whole other list of mods to go with these as well. I know the up pipes are done for and I’m not really a fan of just doing a compressor wheel and calling it good because this turbo has 120k on it and I have the funds to either build it up or replace with bigger. I don’t necessarily have the funds for injectors at the moment because other maintenance items take precedence over the new injectors I have, but I do plan to upgrade in the future. What would you do? Looking for 300 maybe 325 hp. Comparable to a stock 6.0. I don’t want to be forced into replacing the trans if I blow it with too high of hp before I’m ready to upgrade the trans. I’ll probably wait to do the trans right before the injectors since that’ll add the most hp. Once I’m ready to do the trans, I’ll be looking for 400-450. I’m thinking if I do the trans and injectors next year, it would be a better decision to go ahead with a bigger turbo now. Only question is, .84 or 1.00. I’m not going to take your advice lightly. I really appreciate everyone reading and also replying!
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