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Old 11-10-2010, 11:00 AM
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another obamacare topic

i got a question for all of you, and set me straight please. let me know if i am in the right direction here. i wanna know if we are on the same page here.


now the part in the bill about everyone having to purchase health insurance, or be subject to fined is it me or wouldn't this push the lower middle class who cannot afford health insurance into poverty?

let me give you all an example. this woman. her husband is disabled now, and he can't work. he is not collecting any disability or subsidy at all for being disabled. she works, and she works very hard. she makes about $25k grand a year before taxes. she is not technically poverty level, but with how high the cost of living is near me she is. their house is paid for luckily so they don't have a mortgage to pay or rent. she has 3kids who are minors. her first husband owes a lot of money in back child support. he lost his job, and he was sending over a thousand a month. he owes over 100k grand in backpay as well. now she nor her kids are on medicaid. i don't think they are eligible, but i don't know. the kids were on her ex husbands family plan where he works, but he is now unemployed, and doesn't seem to have any intent to get another job, and he isn't getting cobra. so now the kids are uninsured. they are getting by though. they never asked for a handout or subsidy. never applied for food stamps they are fine with how they are getting by, but she needs to work a little harder, and picked up some extra jobs since her ex husbands money started coming in. they are still getting by though. she is a house cleaner, and doesn't make much, but they are getting by.

since i explained their life story i wanna know something. say her ex husband who sends the child support doesn't go back to work at all ever. she is getting by, and probably doesn't have any money left over at the end of the month. so by 2014 she will have to buy health insurance which can probably cost her monthly salary by that time for her whole family? isn't obamacare pushing people into poverty?


take my example of the woman i know. i am sure there are many more out there living the same kind of life. i mean i myself make probably close to three times as more than her when i am not laid off for most of the year, and i have hardly any money left over every month. i am lucky if i can save $200 bucks a month to put aside for car repairs, and maybe things that aren't necessities. i gotta buy cobra when i am laid off, and i think it was $1101 dollars, and some odd sense last year. if i were to be laid off now i would have to pay around $1170, and it's probably gonna go above $1300 a month sometime in 2011. so how is this affordable? is EVERYONE buying insurance really gonna make it cheaper? now the insurance company can't deny those with pre existing conditions, but don't you think the companies are still gonna jack up those peoples rates to the point where they can't afford it?


so tell me. am i right with the assumption obamacare will push some people into poverty? or have i completely missed the point?
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Old 11-10-2010, 02:12 PM
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Well, you have a big majority of the point.
The companies having to cover pre-existing conditions will hurt them some ,but that isn't so bad,they can recover losses if every one keeps paying regularly like they do now ,but what's bad is when all is said and done,you will only need to buy insurance when you are sick-so ins.co's won't get regular monies to cover sick vs. healthy people.
It's just like social security,you pay for the retired people right now,you're not collecting,'til obama kills it
Same fait for insur. co's
But what they want,is for people not to buy,pay the fine,the gov't gets that money-which is way cheaper than insur. costs,then buy when sick-thus pre-existing coverage
This is their way to a single payer system-meaning gov't.
By bankrupting insur,co's,drive people into poverty,keep on with redistribution of wealth,and putting us in a "REAL DITCH"
This is what O ,Reid and Pelosi all want-they are power hungry scum bags!
O's whole plan is to have gov't control everything.
This is just my humble opinion
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Old 11-12-2010, 04:59 AM
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The thing is the woman in your example wouldnt be required to pay a premium. Because of her families income level under the new bill it would be entirely subsidized. You and I would be paying for it.
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Old 11-12-2010, 09:20 AM
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Originally Posted by Dave View Post
The thing is the woman in your example wouldnt be required to pay a premium. Because of her families income level under the new bill it would be entirely subsidized. You and I would be paying for it.
well where exactly is the cutoff though. how about $40k grand a year income? that is real garbage in some parts of the country. if you're single it's a good amount, but with a family? if i made $40k grand a year, and wasn't provided health insurance by my employer than i would be on the street. i would have a hard enough time paying rent[my house would be foreclosed on] feeding my son, paying for gas and diesel just to commute to work, and pretty much everything. let alone not be able to buy health insurance. in the woman, and her family's example i am using it sucks that she would be forced to receive government help, and i can't blame her, because she doesn't want it. if she did she would be down at the county applying for medicaid, food stamps, etc, and she might even be able to qualify for those right now, but doesn't choose to pursue it. man every time i find out a little more about this obamacare and have more of an understanding i'm really spinning my head. it will also make those who are poor who do not want assistance look like a bunch of freeloaders too. unbelievable.
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Old 11-12-2010, 09:30 AM
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IIRC the cutoff in the law was written at somewhere around 40k annual income nationwide.


Which would place the majority of the nation as eligible for government funding
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Old 11-12-2010, 09:37 AM
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Angry

Obama care?
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Old 11-20-2010, 08:35 PM
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just thought of something that pertains to this topic. my best friend is in a similar situation to the woman i spoke of when i made the topic. a couple of years ago he was married. he was married for over 16 years actually. has a 20 year old son, and was making good money working on small engines. anywhere from dirtbikes, other motorcycles, lawnmowers, tractors, boats, and even washing machines and dryers. he was making $25 bucks an hour. they only had one kid, so his wife never really had a full time job during that time, but she had a few part time minimum wage jobs over the years. he was making over $50k grand gross a year, had health insurance for a very low premium, and zero deductible, and cheap co pays. dental, vision, his wife had a lot of health problems too so he got a good deal. if he bought insurance outside of his employer he wouldn't be accepted just like me if i had to, or we wouldn't be able to afford it. he never owned a house, and they never had a brand new car, but they rented nice places, and got by good. always had plenty of food, bills were always paid on time.


about two years ago his wife left him for another man, and eventually he lost his job. just personal difference with the owner. he left, and eventually moved down to florida for a year, and got a job doing small engine repairs down there making good money. probably not as good as up here, because the cost of living is higher here, and so are the wages. his son went into the army and was stationed in kentucky, but eventually was discharged for a health ailment, so my best friend moved back recently here. he got a job working at a restaurant. they pay him only $8.35 an hour, and he works usually 55 hour weeks usually so he gets in some overtime there, and he also goes out with another guy we know who does land clearing a couple times a month to work with him, and he pays him cash for a days work. now i don't know if he would qualify for these entitlements, but he doesn't have insurance anymore. the only help he gets is his landlord rents him a 1000 square foot house with a finished basement as well, and 3 bedrooms for $550 bucks a month which it should be rented for anymore from $1000-$1200 a month, but he knows his situation, and has accomodated him. sometimes his son stays as well, but other times he stays with his girlfriend, and his mother, but he doesn't get along with his mothers new man partly because he's loyal to his dad, and partly because i guess the guy is a dickhead.


so my best friend don't get health insurance however he does get one nice benefit from working in this restaurant, and that is food to take home, so he doesn't really have to buy food at all at home aside from drinks, and other essentials his work doesn't provide him with. dog food and snacks he has to go shopping for. sometimes though his boss is generous enough to give him lobsters, and steaks, and crabs so he takes those home, and makes them for meals. he says if he gets fined for having no insurance he will seriously move to either mexico or canada, and asked if i wanted to go as well half jokingly, and half serious. he drives a 1994 oldsmobile bravada with 225k miles on it, but he has always had clunkers, and gets a new or i should say OLD new car every few months. he also has a ducati street bike. he does have some medical bills that accumulated from after he lost his job, and insurance though. he says he doesn't want any government help on it, and insists he does not want to be subsidized nor fined. so i think it's a joke that he either has to take the subsidy or be subject to fine. this bill is a tax nothing more. anyone who thinks that someone should be fined for not buying insurance is sick. i'm sorry, but they're sick.
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Old 11-21-2010, 03:24 PM
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Of coarse it's sickening,and ALSO unconstitutional to force some one to buy any kind of product or service
But then again-everything this POS congress has done up until present has completely defied the Constitution!!
When in the hell is the law of our country ever going to be enforced on these scum bags-answer:I don't think ever --till Congress is cleaned out totally of career political scum-which may never happen
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Old 11-21-2010, 03:37 PM
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Wasn't GE given exempt status?

While CAT will have to eat $300 mill in healthcare costs.
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Old 11-21-2010, 03:54 PM
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Originally Posted by icysmooth View Post
Of coarse it's sickening,and ALSO unconstitutional to force some one to buy any kind of product or service
But then again-everything this POS congress has done up until present has completely defied the Constitution!!
When in the hell is the law of our country ever going to be enforced on these scum bags-answer:I don't think ever --till Congress is cleaned out totally of career political scum-which may never happen
okay since we are on the same page i wanna post something of an anonymous comment i found from an anonymous website i will not name out of respect to the site. basically someone said this


''On our ballot we have a proposition for the primary that will block Obama's healthcare plan. It passed. Which sucks, because I lose my insurance next month and unless this healthcare reform goes through I won't get insurance back until I'm done with school''

so more than one person told him it sucks he was losing his insurance, but that obama care for the most part was a sham, and most of the bill sucks, and oh yeah we don't even know too much about what the hell is in the bill anyway so here was this kids response.


''No way guys you got it all wrong. Actually it is really important that everyone be required to get health insurance. With how expensive healthcare is, the only way to be able to afford to insure all these people that are currently uninsured is if everyone has to have insurance which would spread the cost around, and make it affordable for everyone.

So when you hear the proposition it makes you think, well of course I don't want the government penalizing me for choosing to not have insurance. But what it doesn't say is that we need to all get insurance so we can all be covered. Also the prices of health care will go down because they will no longer be artificially inflated to unaffordable prices''

so the kid himself cannot afford health insurance, and it's probably because he is in college, and he is being dropped from his mothers plan. so if he can't afford it what makes him think EVERYONE else can? after a few people in a very rational tone called him out on it he no longer posted anything more on the topic. also since when has anything the government put their hands in caused the price to go down? sorry for not being patriotic enough. mexico just may be the best option for me. canada also, but their health care sucks. just like the united states health care will come 2014 if this is not overturned.
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