2003 6.0 - HPOP replacement/BulletProofing, feedback requested... - Ford Powerstroke Diesel Forum
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Old 06-19-2012, 01:07 PM
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2003 6.0 - HPOP replacement/BulletProofing, feedback requested...

Project Overview: 2003 Excursion 6.0 was diagnosed with bad HPOP
Scope: HPOP replacement and various BP items (outlined below)
Current Status: I am almost down to the HPOP (i.e. intake manifold is unbolted and loose) but having issues removing the turbo pedestal (the turbo was already pulled) to allow room for the manifold to come out.

The following is a list of concerns/issues that I was hoping to solicit feedback on.
  1. How many bolts does the 2003 pedestal have? Any photos? I have seen a few photos indicating 4 bolts but I only can see and remove 2.
  2. Is it possible to do a proper and complete coolant flush without the engine/heater running? It would be nice to replace the oil cooler at the same time as HPOP but clearly would trash both if I install new components and then complete the much needed coolant flush.
  3. Any recommendation for replacement pipe/hose kits? (i.e CAC cold/hot,IC)
  4. I am still trying to decide if a BPD oil cooler is worthwhile. I already plan to drop a 1/4 of the price on the OEM oil cooler which may fail on a whim. Any thoughts?
Also, I am planning on welding shut the EGR cooler, installing the upgraded turbo drain pipe, fuel pressure reg. kit, 6.4 banjo bolts, coolant filter, and reconditioning turbo. I would prefer to do head studs at a future date (as symptoms arise) due to current project time constraints.

Any comments/feedback on the outlined project plan are eagerly welcome.

Last edited by 6.0 Diesel Power; 06-19-2012 at 01:15 PM. Reason: font adjustment
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Old 06-19-2012, 02:30 PM
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4 bolts holding the pedestal to engine block, (1st pic) marked in yellow below. Only 3 bolts holding turbo to pedastal, the rear bolt (2nd pic blue circle) is impossible to see and need to feel for it.



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Old 06-19-2012, 02:46 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lilpooh View Post
4 bolts holding the pedestal to engine block, (1st pic) marked in yellow below. Only 3 bolts holding turbo to pedastal, the rear bolt (2nd pic blue circle) is impossible to see and need to feel for it.
Much appreciated!! I only pulled the right two bolts. The front left bolt should be simple (didn't seem attached to the pedestal). I assume a socket coupler made quick work of the rear left? Currently, the EGR cooler is blocking easy access.

Last edited by 6.0 Diesel Power; 06-19-2012 at 02:49 PM.
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Old 06-19-2012, 02:54 PM
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The first post in this thread may help you, click on the PDF attachments.
Oil cooler and EGR cooler service PDF files and notes
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Old 06-19-2012, 03:57 PM
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See comments:
Quote:
Originally Posted by 6.0 Diesel Power View Post
Project Overview: 2003 Excursion 6.0 was diagnosed with bad HPOP
  1. How many bolts does the 2003 pedestal have? Any photos? I have seen a few photos indicating 4 bolts but I only can see and remove 2.There are 4 bolts, could be covered with dirt but there are 4
  2. Is it possible to do a proper and complete coolant flush without the engine/heater running? It would be nice to replace the oil cooler at the same time as HPOP but clearly would trash both if I install new components and then complete the much needed coolant flush.Well yes and no, you're not going to do any chemical flush. If you wanted to do a pretty good flush, then remove the radiator and water pump block plugs. Use a hose to flush the individual circuits, reverse flush the heater core. Flush the radiator every way that you can (upside down, sideways, etc). An added advantage of these things out is you can stand in there to replace the rest of the parts on top of the engine, very handy! Be aware that it's going to start to develop surface rust inside the block (the bonded on silicates will protect some), so don't let it hang too long in this condition.
  3. Any recommendation for replacement pipe/hose kits? (i.e CAC cold/hot,IC) In that deep, replace the ICP and wiring harness, turbo drain tube, and might as well upgrade to the blue FP spring
  4. I am still trying to decide if a BPD oil cooler is worthwhile. I already plan to drop a 1/4 of the price on the OEM oil cooler which may fail on a whim. Any thoughts?Tough call. While I do believe that the BPD EGR cooler is top notch, you have a 2003 which has a pretty strong EGR cooler. I elected to keep the 2003 cooler (and functional) simply because of conversations with tech's who rarely if ever had to replace a verified bad one. I kept my original EGR cooler and with a fully functional oil cooler, I am really not worried about EGR cooler failure.
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Old 06-24-2012, 05:50 AM
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Thanks for the additional links Lilpooh - great resource!

I got the pedestal off and ultimately the intake manifold in about 5 minutes. After looking at the photos and reading your guys tips, I realized that I couldn't see the bolts covered in dirt and oil sludge under the poor lighting condition I initially attempted.

nylyon - great insight, much appreciated! I recently knocked out the ICP and wiring harness prior to my HPOP going bad, but will reinspect; updated turbo drain tube and fuel pressure reg springs are sitting in garage awaiting their time for install . Good idea re: radiator - planning to follow this. I think I will stay with the OEM cooler from an economics standpoint. Also, I have heard similar things about the 03 EGR cooler. However, while I have this thing apart, I am leaning towards just welding the cooler shut prior to reinstall.

Quick follow-up question regarding coolant flush. I am hoping to swap over to CAT EC-1. My understanding to swap from Gold to EC-1 is I need to run a chemical flush through the system (i.e. Restore). I read through the excellent guide on coolant flush and noted back flushing via the EGR cooler outlet does a good job getting the build up out of the system. Using this method, is it feasible to do a chemical flush without starting the engine?

I was hoping to knock out the oil cooler replacement at the same time as the HPOP vs. putting everything back together just to swap coolant and then tear down to replace oil cooler.
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Old 06-24-2012, 06:32 AM
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When chemical flushing with either Restore, VC-9, Restore plus, the motor must be at operating temp (190*).
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Old 06-24-2012, 09:37 AM
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Not everyone is convinced that the chemical flushes are a necessary requirement for converting from G-05 to EC-1 coolants in every case.

It isn't clear to me why you want to change the oil cooler, or what the condition of the cooling system currently is. Depending on what the answers to these are, it may or may not be reasonable to consider just flushing everything out with the hose while it's apart, running some distilled through it when it's back together, and refilling with an EC-1 coolant.
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Old 06-30-2012, 04:55 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by L&B View Post
Not everyone is convinced that the chemical flushes are a necessary requirement for converting from G-05 to EC-1 coolants in every case.

It isn't clear to me why you want to change the oil cooler, or what the condition of the cooling system currently is. Depending on what the answers to these are, it may or may not be reasonable to consider just flushing everything out with the hose while it's apart, running some distilled through it when it's back together, and refilling with an EC-1 coolant.
Thank you for the feedback. I was looking to replace the oil cooler after the coolant flush as I have read the dislodged particles would trash the oil cooler. Additionally, the minimal extra effort required to knock it out while doing the HPOP made it appealing.

The condition of the cooling system is somewhat unknown. With 120k miles and no coolant flush to date (to my knowledge), I am looking to proactively address issues that may arise due to the neglect in maintenance up to this point. I had a no start/stall issue and per the Ford scanner, it was diagnosed that the HPOP went bad with a possible HP oil leak as well. While fixing this is main goal, I am trying to make some steps towards bullet proofing (sans the head gaskets/bolts at this time).

Based on this, any comments re: reasonableness to skip chemical flush? Has there been success without damaging the oil cooler? Is the effectiveness of new coolant reduced?
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Old 06-30-2012, 06:52 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 6.0 Diesel Power View Post
Thank you for the feedback. I was looking to replace the oil cooler after the coolant flush as I have read the dislodged particles would trash the oil cooler. Additionally, the minimal extra effort required to knock it out while doing the HPOP made it appealing.

The condition of the cooling system is somewhat unknown. With 120k miles and no coolant flush to date (to my knowledge), I am looking to proactively address issues that may arise due to the neglect in maintenance up to this point. I had a no start/stall issue and per the Ford scanner, it was diagnosed that the HPOP went bad with a possible HP oil leak as well. While fixing this is main goal, I am trying to make some steps towards bullet proofing (sans the head gaskets/bolts at this time).

Based on this, any comments re: reasonableness to skip chemical flush? Has there been success without damaging the oil cooler? Is the effectiveness of new coolant reduced?
My own truck (and I know of several others) was converted to ELC without chemical flushing, with deltas dropping by a degree or two. There seems to be at least some limited agreement that the protective layer left on the on surfaces by the G-05 is slowly replaced in use by the ELC, and PGreenSVT has suggested that it might worth considering a drain/refill in the 2 year / 50k mile range. This seems reasonable to me regardless of the process used in the flush and conversion; whether or not it is strictly necessary in any case is probably an open question.

The only question that I haven't seen addressed is what the EOT/ECT were before the HPOP failed. If they were perfect, then changing the oil cooler could be a bit of a waste. However, since you're into it that far I'm certainly of the opinion that it wouldn't hurt to put a new one in. Since you don't say that yours has ruptured and flooded the coolant side with oil I'll also assume that it doesn't display any other obvious signs of problems. IF IT WERE MINE, I would attack it long and hard with the hose while it's apart, drain thoroughly, reassemble and flush with distilled before refilling with ELC.

In my opinion, that course presents the greatest probability of success with minimum risk and effort, given the information we have so far.
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