What should i do with my 6.0 Truck??? - Ford Powerstroke Diesel Forum
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Old 11-13-2011, 08:28 PM
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What should i do with my 6.0 Truck???

Hey everyone. My truck is currently down getting a ficm and 2,3,4, and 7 injectors. FICM showed 30 volts and obviously truck ran like crap till warmed up. Anyway, my dilemma is what do i do with this truck? I mean everybody tells me to get rid of it before it costs 10 grand to repair. A buddy of mine owns a chain of automotive repair stores here locally and every time he see's me he tells me to sell it while its still going good. I really like my truck and everyone tells me i'm the luckiest SOB in the world since i havent had a problem with my truck yet. Its an 2007 F250 with 84,000 miles currently.

I mean ive been thinking just run it till its done and somehow start looking into a cummins 12v swap or something. Or should i sell / trade it in and get something else? i dunno
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Old 11-13-2011, 08:31 PM
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run it, I have 180k on the ticker and I love mine. I work her hard every day
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Old 11-13-2011, 08:48 PM
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Well, what all should i do to the motor to make it reliable? EGR stuff? oil cooler? i read the EGR cooler goes bad and causes most problems. In my state there is no emissions test of anykind. Can i delete all this stuff? If so how? Im assuming egr valve an cooler gets tossed.

Ive never done anything really to my truck aside from oil/filter changes, 2 new batteries this year (assuming thats what took out my FICM), and thats it.

My buddy that owns the car repair stores said they have done a lot of the egr delete kits and stuff. He told me i needed to do that as that is what causes most of the problems with these trucks. So he said.
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Old 11-13-2011, 09:26 PM
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Keep it. The reputation this engine has is from ill informed owners ignoring known issues that are easy to fix. The thing about this engine is that the small things can snowball out of control if you ignore the warning signs.
For example, the real reason why most of all the head gaskets that gave this engine the bad reputation failed was because of the lack of maintenance on a fluid that nearly everyone ignores. Coolant.
The Ford Gold coolant requires very careful and frequent monitoring. It needs to be checked at a minimum of every 6 months/600 engine hours/15,000 miles, whichever occurs first. It also needs to be completely flushed and replaced every 45,000 miles...and this is per FORD themselves. Here is the Ford TSB for coolant maintenance: CLICK HERE
Now, you are asking yourself, how the heck could poor maintenance on coolant cause the head gaskets to fail...right? Simple....once you understand this engine.
Heat in the engine will slowly deplete the nitrite level in the coolant. Once the coolant nitrite level falls, the coolant can no longer deal with the high heat that the egr system throws at it. The coolant breaks down and creates a gunk. Also, as the nitrite level falls (and the corrosion protection falls with it) rust scale will form within the cooling system.
Now you have gunk and rust particles floating in the cooling system...that wouldn't be such a big deal except that the oil cooler in this engine has coolant and oil going through it in very small passages. Guess where all that gunk/rust scale builds up? You got it. The oil cooler.
If you have the proper gauge set on your truck and know what to look for, you can stop the landslide that ends in head gasket failure right here. Most owners don't add the necessary gauges. The telltale sign is seeing the oil temps exceeding the coolant temps by 15F or more cruising down a flat section of highway, unloaded, at around 65MPH for a few minutes. Easy test, right? On with the rest of the story.....
That clogging of the coolant passages will allow the oil to heat up faster and the clog will slow down the coolant flow. The coolant that exits the oil cooler is directly fed right to the egr cooler. Keep in mind that the exhaust gases of your truck can easily exceed 1000F, and the egr coolers job is to cool those gases before they are reintroduced back into the engine. Not an easy job to accomplish with no restrictions. Slow down that coolant flow and that will cause the egr cooler to overheat, and eventually fail.
When the egr cooler fails, coolant leaks out of the egr cooler. This coolant will flow up to the egr valve and sit there waiting for the egr valve to open, and when it does, your engine gulps down a shot of coolant. Get enough coolant going in this direction and the cylinder pressures will rise beyond what the stock head bolts were designed to withstand.
The head bolts stretch due to the higher pressures and the head gaskets fail. Most of the time the telltale sign of the egr cooler leaking is the expulsion of steam out through the tailpipe.
Coolant leaking out of the egr cooler can also wreak havoc on the turbo. The exhaust connection for the egr cooler is just previous to the turbo in the "up-pipe" on the passenger side of the engine. The coolant from the egr cooler failure flows out into the exhaust and is forced through the turbo along with the exhaust flow (when the egr valve is closed). That is the side of the turbo that contains the vanes that control the boost. In this instance you are mixing coolant, soot and heat. That will create a muck that will interfere with the free movement of the vanes and create an "over boost" or an "under boost" condition. The presence of coolant in the turbo can also pit the surface on which the unison ring slides on (it moves the vanes in "unison", hence the name). Should the rust pitting be extensive enough, that would require the replacement of the turbo, at a minimum you will have to split the turbo and clean it at this point.
We aren't done yet... The coolant will still leak out of the egr failure when the truck is shut off. The coolant leaks downward since there is no exhaust flow to push it up into the turbo. Coolant will pool in the exhaust manifold on the passenger side. Once there is enough coolant in the manifold, it will then flow into whatever cylinder happens to have the exhaust valves open when the engine is shut off. The cylinder will then fill with coolant, and when you turn the key, the coolant has nowhere to go and the engine will hydrolock.
All of this is very preventable. One is to be anal retentive when it comes to maintaining your coolant. The second way is to add the right gauges and monitor the coolant temp and oil temps, and fixing the oil cooler BEFORE it takes out your egr cooler.

Now, when the oil cooler plugs up and needs to be replaced, you will have to think about whether or not you want to delete the egr cooler all together. I say that if your area does not have diesel emissions testing, will not have it for years to come and you are willing to take the small chance that some cop out there with a chip on his shoulder would check for it, delete it. I have. If you have emissions testing, or will have it in the future, or you want to keep it for one reason or another, buy the BEST egr cooler made. Bulletproof diesel EGR cooler.
CLICK HERE to see the difference between the stock design and the bulletproof design.

Should you keep this truck? If you love that truck as much as I love mine, absolutely. Just get the gauges on there NOW. The edge cts is a fairly popular electronic gauge set. I have an old edge insight (which isn't even made anymore). The electronic style gauges end up being a little cheaper than adding all the gauges you will want/need.

There is also another way around that coolant issue. It requires an extensive two-chemical flush that would take you about 6-7 hours to accomplish, then changing the coolant type that you use. Many of the forum members here have done this flush and swapped out the FORD gold coolant in favor of an ELC style coolant. Not just any ELC coolant will do though. The ELC coolant must meet/exceed the CAT EC-1 rating. There are many ELC's that do this. Shell has a Rotella ELC that is supposed to be "the best of the best," International (manufacturer of the engine) also sells the "Fleetrite" brand, available at most of their Truck dealerships, and NAPA also sells a CAT EC-1 rated ELC coolant made by ZEREX.
Another modification that you should seriously consider is adding a coolant filtration system. CLICK HERE to see the most popular system and the one I have on my truck.
Welcome to the ORG!

As an edit: I just noticed you have a bullydog.....that tuner is pretty harsh on your transmission...just saying.....
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Old 11-13-2011, 10:00 PM
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So since ive never had the coolant flushed or hell even looked at it, i guess i should do that. So aside from having a oil temp gauge, i have no way of knowing if the oil cooler is stopped up or not?

How often are you supposed to replace the oil cooler? I was looking at the egr delete kits that included an oil cooler. Bullet proof diesel, or river city.
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Old 11-13-2011, 11:30 PM
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That was some really good info. Helped me out much!
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Old 11-14-2011, 12:21 AM
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That was a great right up. Keep the truck and keep up the maintainance.
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Old 11-14-2011, 01:41 AM
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You need more than an oil temp gauge as you also need to know the coolant temp in order to watch the temp delta between the 2. You also want to monitor fuel pressure as low fuel pressure will kill your injectors. I suggest an Edge Insight monitor system which will pretty much let you see anything your trucks computer watches. You also should consider a good 5w40 synthetic motor oil as a hedge against injector stiction which is mostly caused by varnish buildup on the spool valves. Be anal about service intervals and do not postpone oil changes. They are critical to the health of your 6.0.
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Old 11-14-2011, 03:18 AM
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Another issue with 6.0's is misdiagnosis. They can be tricky to diagnose and a lot of shops make assumptions.

For example, you might have 4 bad injectors, but you also have an issue with the FICM which controls the injectors. I would never condemn 4 injectors knowing I had existing FICM problems. If the FICM is not controlling the injectors properly it might look like you have bad injectors.

I would start with fixing the FICM. Then re-diagnose and check over all other possibilities for low power and missing, like checking fuel pressure, boost. If you don't have a constant dead miss then you might be able to get away with switching to a synthetic oil and trying some Rev-x. If you ever start throwing parts at these trucks it will get expensive real fast. Another reason they have a bad rep.
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Old 11-14-2011, 06:53 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PGreenSVT View Post
You need more than an oil temp gauge as you also need to know the coolant temp in order to watch the temp delta between the 2. You also want to monitor fuel pressure as low fuel pressure will kill your injectors. I suggest an Edge Insight monitor system which will pretty much let you see anything your trucks computer watches. You also should consider a good 5w40 synthetic motor oil as a hedge against injector stiction which is mostly caused by varnish buildup on the spool valves. Be anal about service intervals and do not postpone oil changes. They are critical to the health of your 6.0.
What he said about fuel pressure and oil!!
You will, however, have to add a sensor to monitor the fuel pressure. The engine does not have an existing sensor that an electronic gauge set could access.
If you wanted to monitor oil pressure, you would also have to add a sensor, since the existing 'sensor' is nothing more than a switch. If that switch sees more than just 7psi, it will read normal on your dash gauge. That is one prime example of why you can never trust the gauges on your dashboard. By the time any of them react, it is too late. The oil pressure gauge is not really a requirement, since if the oil pressure falls too low, the truck will not run.
I would suggest that when you install your electronic monitor, you access the PID for the transmission fluid temp if you tow anything. Fords "long term limit" for trans fluid temp is 250F (this info came from a former Ford Auto Trans Engineer).
One more thing that would be good to monitor, but would also require the addition of a sensor, is the exhaust gas temp. This is useful when towing and for lengthening the life of your turbo. At shut down, if you allow the truck to idle to lower the EGT's to 400F-350F, the oil that is sitting in the turbo at shut will be much less likely to coke and create a bearing issue as time goes on. Keeping the EGT's below 1400F will also help lengthen the life of your turbo.
Why Ford didn't install a REAL gauge set on this type of truck is beyond me.
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