Is there too much ELC Hype? - Ford Powerstroke Diesel Forum

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post #1 of 49 Old 05-24-2011, 09:52 AM Thread Starter
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Is there too much ELC Hype?

As I read through the various forums and posts, it almost seems that half of the posts now are regarding coolant, flushing and ELC. Now I'll admit I have my fair share of oil cooler posting but I have to wonder, is ELC actually preventing issues? I am starting to see oil cooler postings where the owner had switched to ELC already, and to be fair they may have already had a clogged cooler, but the question still stands, how is ELC doing, has it prevented oil cooler issues (EGR cooler issues) and just as importantly has it actually improved your ECT / EOT delta's?

For the record, I finally switched to Zerex ELC over the weekend and glad I did.

- Karl
2003 F-250 Crew Cab Short Bed Lariat PSD 6.0 Automatic FX4 Edge Insight with EGT Probe. Coolant Filter. All 6.0's need gauges
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post #2 of 49 Old 05-24-2011, 10:11 AM
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IMO, its a waste of time and money. I'll just keep my Ford gold coolant on a 50k replacement interval


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post #3 of 49 Old 05-24-2011, 10:17 AM
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i've had elc in there for a year now (which is a short amout of time) and no issues.
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post #4 of 49 Old 05-24-2011, 10:53 AM
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Very good question nylon!!! I did not think of this. And I like how you a willing to question what can be thought as the norm
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post #5 of 49 Old 05-24-2011, 11:07 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nylyon View Post
How is ELC doing, has it prevented oil cooler issues (EGR cooler issues) and just as importantly has it actually improved your ECT / EOT delta's?

For the record, I finally switched to Zerex ELC over the weekend and glad I did.
When the truck is going down the road no load delta is with in 5* but when towing when the motor is working hard it is easy to hit 15* or more temp spread. I do feel the coolant I have in will last longer than the gold under towing conditions.

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post #6 of 49 Old 05-24-2011, 11:36 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nylyon View Post
As I read through the various forums and posts, it almost seems that half of the posts now are regarding coolant, flushing and ELC. Now I'll admit I have my fair share of oil cooler posting but I have to wonder, is ELC actually preventing issues? I am starting to see oil cooler postings where the owner had switched to ELC already, and to be fair they may have already had a clogged cooler, but the question still stands, how is ELC doing, has it prevented oil cooler issues (EGR cooler issues) and just as importantly has it actually improved your ECT / EOT delta's?

For the record, I finally switched to Zerex ELC over the weekend and glad I did.
Hi Karl,
You are an oil cooler post wh0re! I'm very glad to have you and your experiences being shared here. I'm quite curious about your last statement since it seems to suggest that there was a reason you are glad you made the change.

I can't speak directly to the topic at hand since I'm running the BPD setup, but I am still running the GOLD coolant despite having purchased my Zerex ELC about a year or so ago (I'm guessing). I have datalogged considerably both before and after the BPD setup, but I'm guessing that the results would be quite different than folks running the stock oil cooler setup. For now, I'll try to be content to sit in the back and observe. As always, if I start to get out of hand, just smack me around a bit and I'll go back to my corner.

Shawn Carlson
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post #7 of 49 Old 05-24-2011, 11:58 AM Thread Starter
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My last statement was simply to show my camaraderie with those who have made the switch. I have been reading posts where ELC is being hailed as the 6.0 fix-all by actually reversing the effects of G-05 and silicate coating. Not sure how much of that I believe (if any at all) but I am interested in seeing if there is a reduction in oil cooler failures, overheating or other cooling system mis-haps.

- Karl
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post #8 of 49 Old 05-24-2011, 12:13 PM
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I'm with Bill. I'll change my Ford Gold every 30k-35k miles and call it a day.

YouTube - ‪6.0 POWERSTROKE - SPRING COOLANT CHECK UP‬‏

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post #9 of 49 Old 05-24-2011, 01:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nylyon View Post
My last statement was simply to show my camaraderie with those who have made the switch. I have been reading posts where ELC is being hailed as the 6.0 fix-all by actually reversing the effects of G-05 and silicate coating. Not sure how much of that I believe (if any at all) but I am interested in seeing if there is a reduction in oil cooler failures, overheating or other cooling system mis-haps.

I have been posting that it won't fix a bad oil cooler and if you're not sure what you're dealing with to replace it. I feel better know that I have ELC in the cooling system even though I deleted the egr and run a BPD oil cooler.
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post #10 of 49 Old 05-24-2011, 01:44 PM
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Those who are saying they will stick with a mileage whether using Premium Gold OR an EC-1 rated ELC are BOTH missing the critical components present in any fluid duty cycle namely contamination threshold or neutralization capacity.

For engine oil this is easy. Consider contamination threshold: 20 micron filtration (stock filter) is not as good as 2 micron filtration (oil bypass filtration) but this is not the complete story as eventually the filter fills up with contaminants; it is obstructed. Now consider neutralization capacity: TBN above 1.0 means there is sufficient additive to prevent acid induced corrosion but there is also shear resistance (neutralizing friction over a period of time...perhaps neutralization is not the most accurate way to describe this but shear stability is a measure of the engine oil to provide consistent lubrication over a period of time during conditions that cause a chemical breakdown...sort of like acid/base neutralization - sort of). In any case, with used oil analysis (UOA) there is no doubt that when wear metal concentration rises it is an indication of the oil being less effective. When UOA shows falling TBN it indicates the oil has less capacity to prevent corrosion. When UOA shows viscosity reduction it indicates less protection to moving parts at operational temperature. There is an accepted duty cycle for engine oil, recommended by the manufacturer, of 5k to 7.5k miles BUT with UOA you may have to make adjustments lower (some may go higher although I haven't seen many oils that can handle the shear induced by the 6.0L for longer than 7.5k-miles, TBN and contaminants are no problem for most especially those with bypass filtration).

The same considerations ought to be applied to coolant whether Premium Gold or EC-1 rated ELCs (of which there are many). Premium Gold (which is technically an ELC and causes quite a few folks some confusion) begins with VERY LOW nitrite level...forget about silicates for a moment although those silicates should not be ignored...nitrites are a corrosion inhibitor. Corrosion induced by cavitation, AKA erosion corrosion, will literally eat an engine bit by bit all with microscopic bubbles. Corrosion in large part is a result of oxidation. See this link:
Water Purification Handbook Chapter 24 Corrosion Control-Cooling Systems
Water has an oxidation state of one. Nitrites have an oxidation state of two. As I mentioned, Premium Gold starts with low nitrite concentration (I think 800ppm) yet the minimum threshold in industry is 800ppm! Nitrites are depleted rapidly through chemical reaction. See here:
Learning Coolant Fundamentals
In an EC-1 rated ELC, carboxylates are introduced to provide cavitation protection extending the life of nitrites. Carboxylates have an oxidation state of three. Additionally, carboxylates add corrosion inhibitors for steel while nitrites only inhibit corrosion in iron. Most EC-1 ELCs also start with a nitrite level well above 800ppm.

The bottom line is that without periodic testing and analysis - an interval based on mileage is problematic and any desirable attributes such as corrosion protection or contamination avoidance is absent potentially and a false sense of security provided. That is the fundamental flaw of "fill-and-forget" in practice.

For what it's worth...the need for the discussion is still relevant from my perspective.

Jonathan

Jonathan D. Howell
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