Titration in relation to PH - Ford Powerstroke Diesel Forum
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post #1 of 11 Old 12-09-2008, 12:09 PM Thread Starter
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Titration in relation to PH

Whats the corilation...or is there one?
I want a fast easy way to test PH levels of the vegi oil i use.
I understand very little about what actually occures durring a titration test but i think i understand that it is a measure of FFA in the oil? Correct?
Is there any link to PH from this test?
I titrated som eoil over at a friends house the other day - he knows how to do this and has all the stuff.
It was the nastiest oil i ever collected and i was curious. It titrated at 15. Now i know its full of chicken fat - i can see a visible layer of lighter collored fat in the bottom half. But this just means its crap as far as making Bio-D...it still burnes nicely in my straight vegi conversion. I just want to test for PH levels. Is there an easy way?

2003 6.0 F350 dually on high cholesterol fuel (WVO)
2000 7.3 Excursion also on a high cholesterol fuel



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post #2 of 11 Old 12-09-2008, 12:14 PM
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you should be able to buy some of that litmus paper (I think thats how its spelled) and dip it into the oil, then compare the color that it turns with a provided chart

edit: pH - Tester

Last edited by stroken04; 12-09-2008 at 12:17 PM.
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post #3 of 11 Old 12-09-2008, 12:18 PM
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Go to a pool or hot tub supply company. They'll have test kits with strips in them so you can test the pH of whatever you want.


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post #4 of 11 Old 12-09-2008, 12:59 PM Thread Starter
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a PH test on oil won't work.

2003 6.0 F350 dually on high cholesterol fuel (WVO)
2000 7.3 Excursion also on a high cholesterol fuel



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post #5 of 11 Old 12-09-2008, 01:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CHenry View Post
a PH test on oil won't work.
That figures, I wonder why?
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post #6 of 11 Old 12-09-2008, 01:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CHenry View Post
a PH test on oil won't work.
Was going to say I thought we had this discussion a few months ago and came to that conclusion.

Dont remembber what it was, but I think PH is testing the current acid/base state where titration is breaking down the oil to its seperate components and seeing what acid level is created, and would need to be neutralized in Biodiesel.

The Pyhnothalene (spelled wrong I know) is the dropper bottle from a pool store that measures acid level, that is used in the titration test. which defines the acid base line. Its acidic until you add enough of the NaOH solution to push the solution to a base and it turns pink.

So the isopropyl breakdown makes the FFA into acid, and you are testing the acidity, not sure what titration value corilates to PH level, but I think they are still pretty close, where BD is not acidic even if its isnt neutralized correctly.



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post #7 of 11 Old 12-09-2008, 04:33 PM Thread Starter
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A titration of 15 would cross corolate to a base number that would burn your finger off. A base solution has a high PH number. An Acid would be a 1 while nuetral is a 7 and a base is a higher number like 14 So a PH 15 would be a caustic that would ment my engine block.


2003 6.0 F350 dually on high cholesterol fuel (WVO)
2000 7.3 Excursion also on a high cholesterol fuel



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post #8 of 11 Old 12-09-2008, 05:28 PM
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Clay--

as I understand it, titration is simply a method which determines the FFA content and the amount of catalyst needed to cause the chemical reaction esterfication to occur.

The titration process assumes the pH needed to cause a reaction to occur is 8.5. The addition of NaOH soultion during the titration process raises the pH of the oil and the phenythalein indicates a pH of 8.5 when it turns pink. The more NaOH you added (you mentioned 15?) during the process, the more acidic the WVO was.

The pH of the oil is certainly part of the titration process, and I am sure you could get an approximate pH from testing. I doubt you would get a numerical value or quantitative measurement from the results of titration that would give you an exact answer.

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post #9 of 11 Old 12-10-2008, 06:19 AM
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hey this sounds like something we talked about one time

a 15 would make some bio that is VERY soapy in a single stage reaction. not fun. I tried a 12 once and washed it many many many times and still made crappy bio.

so your 15 oil burns well in the svo kit? that is good to hear. I can get a supply of 15 to 20 oil but passed up on it a while ago because it sucks for bio. I better go talk to them again!

Just a basic 01 F350 CCLB SRW -Good from a far but far from good
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post #10 of 11 Old 12-10-2008, 06:21 AM
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here is some good info

Titrating Oil - Collaborative Biodiesel Tutorial

Just a basic 01 F350 CCLB SRW -Good from a far but far from good
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