Questions on DIY WVO conversions - Ford Powerstroke Diesel Forum
Bio-Diesel/Alternative Fuels and Supplements Bio-Diesel and related Discussion. Ask Questions and discuss what has worked for you here.

Powerstroke.org is the premier Diesel Truck Forum on the internet. Registered Users do not see the above ads.
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 01-23-2013, 08:40 AM
Compression Ignition Addict
 

Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Charlottesville
Posts: 160
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Questions on DIY WVO conversions

So I've been reading a lot of threads, and know I have a lot more to learn. I know what I need to do to filter the oil, and will likely try and build my own centrifuge, but that's another story. I have some specific questions. I know it's asking a lot, but there are so many threads to read, and not a lot of step-by-step overviews of conversions. Maybe y'all can point me to specific threads to read??

1. Before discussing which one to use, I'm thinking about putting the auxiliary fuel heater along the frame rail, underneath the truck. Is this what most people do?? Maybe I'm wrong; shouldn't it be as close to the fuel tank as possible?

2. I'm thinking about using the front tank for WVO, only because the shorter length of fuel line involved, and distance from the water pump. I'd have to run so much more coolant line to the inline heater, and would have more trouble fitting it in.I know it's a smaller tank, but I'm just thinking ease of installation; maybe I'm gonna kick myself later. I just worry about the few feet of potentially unheated fuel in the fuel line between the tank and the pollak switching valve. I've seen obviously homemade wrap-around coils to go on your fuel line, but don't want to run more electric lines and relays if I don't have to. I'm already going to be running at least one.

3.I've been looking at a few different designs for add-on inline dual heated (12v and engine coolant), with supplemental filter cartridges. I'm looking hardest at these two, but leaning towards the second one:

Coolant 12V Heated Twin Spin on Filter WVO SVO Diesel Biodiesel Vegestable Oil | eBay

Coolant 12V Heated Pre Filter WVO Diesel Biodiesel Diesel Water Animal Fat Trap | eBay

It seems that with the combination of 12v heat when necessary and engine coolant would lessen the warm-up time required on petro-diesel. Assuming I filter the heck out of it before putting it in the tank, is there really a need for a supplemental filter, or would the all-in-one-cylinder "separator" style one work alright? It would seem that the first one has the 12v source before the coolant source--this wouldn't help me much at all on really cold days, but it has two in-line filter cartridges. I'm worried about that causing too much restriction if it's on the suction side of the pump.

4. How much purge time do you have to allow to clear the wvo from the fuel bowl?? I know that if I've been running wvo into the fuel bowl for any length of time, it will be just about 100% veg. oil in there. I realize that there will be a bit of cross-contamination by way of veggie oil going into the return line, but if I keep the petro-diesel tank full, shouldn't the percentage should be small enough?? Eventually I'd love to either convert the system to an electric pump with no return, but that's not easy or cheap. I know there can be problems if you shut down the engine with a fuel bowl full of waste veggie oil on a cold day--it'll gel up and not start again when cold. How many of you run without regulating this return feed of veg oil to the pump? --I'm asking because I can't seem to find out the %of return for the factory mechanical lift pump. I'd like to know how much roughly the engine is using at idle, and how much the lift pump is returning to the tank. My first thought to combat this is to either beef up the stock fuel bowl heater, or retrofit one that could be plugged into 110v current while the truck is sitting. That still wouldn't take care of what was in the fuel rails, however. Any thoughts??
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
  #2  
Old 01-23-2013, 11:33 AM
Powerstroke.org Rookie
 

Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 20
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
A good site that I learnt a lot from is UK based - vegetable oil diesel - home - good site for wvo users/blenders/bio diesel
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #3  
Old 01-23-2013, 01:55 PM
Compression Ignition Addict
 

Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Charlottesville
Posts: 160
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
I tried registering for their site and got a "permanent error" returned message. I'm still looking for answers.,.....so many threads, so little time. I'm hoping that I don't end up having to put a three way valve on the return line for purging. I just had to replace the expensive pollak switching valve.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #4  
Old 01-24-2013, 05:30 AM
Compression Ignition Addict
 

Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Charlottesville
Posts: 160
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
So after reading about 50 different threads, I now realize that most veggie oil burners consider it a given that you have to do away with the stock fuel pump if using wvo and not brewing biodiesel, so that you have separate filtration systems on each and do away with the factory fuel bowl. It totally sucks that I just rebuilt the fuel bowl, and had to replace the fuel pump. $$$$$$$$$$


And, most systems don't use the factory switching valve, the pollack valve. How do they end up failing? I'm in the middle of putting a new one in right now, because I broke off one of the hose barbs. $250 mistake.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #5  
Old 01-24-2013, 10:58 AM
Powerstroke.org Rookie
 

Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 20
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
I dont know if it is any help. My system is as follows -
small tank at the front of the bed takes the diesel, main tank takes filtered wvo (or wvo/diesel mix depending on time of year). A flat plate heat exchanger is mounted above the exhaust manifold and tee'd into the cooling system. Start up is on diesel with its own lines and filter to the pollack valve. The main tank holds the wvo which runs through its own lines to the heat exchanger, then though its own filter and into the pollack. The pollack is mounted just above the injector pump, reducing the fuel quantity on switchover. Once up to temperature the diesel is switched off and the wvo switched on. About 1/2 mile before stopping I switch back to diesel. While the engine is warming up the heat exchanger is warming up the wvo ready for switch over. The 2 lines/filters is also handy in the event of a fiter blockage
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #6  
Old 01-24-2013, 12:52 PM
Compression Ignition Addict
 

Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 1,345
Thanks: 0
Thanked 3 Times in 3 Posts
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Having converted numerous SD trucks, and having workded on the OBS platform, I recomend one important preliminary step. Switch over to full electric fuel just like a SD, and ditch the mechanical crap. It will cause far more trouble than it could ever save you in dollars.

After that its simple. Double deadhead system. Forget the front tank/back tank BS, and build, buy or otherwise aquire a suitable aluminum or stainless tank for in the bed. A simple heat exchanger in the tank, coolant Heated fuel filter housing of your liking, a FPHE if running VO, TIH from tank to filter,and a fass under the hood-DONE! (Omit the FPHE ifrunning B100)

Skip the vegtherms, glow plug heated blah, blah, blah, ebay crap and be done. Add a purge valve in the VO side with a two port Hydraforce valve and call it a day. Use a simple MOM/OFF/ON rocker switch to control the system and dont forget the temp gauge and fuel pressure guage. They will diagnose most problems, and ensure your engine is protected.

Guys, its just my $.02, but Ihave done many of them. KISS method is usually best in my opinion.

(If you use more than one worm gear clamp on the fuel side of the above fuel system, you did something wrong. 37* JIC is you friend!)
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #7  
Old 01-24-2013, 03:12 PM
Compression Ignition Addict
 

Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Nova Scotia
Posts: 686
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
My conversion is almost identical to what Veggin has described. Only difference is my Fass is under the truck on the frame rail. I soon will have 80k miles since I converted & truck still runs good. Had some pump issues at the start, a few leaks & electrical issues but otherwise good results.

Listen to Veggin. He's been there, done that.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #8  
Old 01-24-2013, 07:57 PM
Compression Ignition Addict
 

Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Charlottesville
Posts: 160
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Alright, so I'm sold on the idea of going ahead and replacing the fuel pump(s). The in-bed tank though is a no-go at this point. While I would REALLY love the extended range of a large tank, I regularly haul large loads of fresh logs. I just can't give up 2' of bed space permanently. I have a toolbox that I can take out and get a good 20% more wood in the bed. I would consider a narrow maybe 8-10" wide tank the entire width of the bed, as long as I could get a 4x8' sheet of plywood or an 8' 2x4"underneath it, as in bolted up off of the bottom of the bed. My current toolbox is a deep-well one, with about 4" of space underneath it.



So, after putting the pumps in, what controls them?? I mean, the stock pump pumps faster as the engine revs higher. I don't understand the setup--I know the IDM tells the injectors to open & how far, but what is telling the electric fuel pump to pump faster if it's a dead-end setup?????
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #9  
Old 01-24-2013, 10:06 PM
Powerstroke.org Rookie
 

Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 20
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
When you guys talk of a Fass pump - is this an electrical pump that is used to draw fuel up for ignition?. Do all your trucks use an electrical pump? Mine are mechanical (built into the injector pump - so it draws fuel and injects) very similar to a Bosch system. Otherwise everything else seems very similar.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #10  
Old 01-25-2013, 03:28 AM
Compression Ignition Addict
 

Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 1,345
Thanks: 0
Thanked 3 Times in 3 Posts
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Quote:
Originally Posted by ardlanish View Post
When you guys talk of a Fass pump - is this an electrical pump that is used to draw fuel up for ignition?. Do all your trucks use an electrical pump? Mine are mechanical (built into the injector pump - so it draws fuel and injects) very similar to a Bosch system. Otherwise everything else seems very similar.
This must be an IDI, non powerstroke truck?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Woodturner Nate View Post
Alright, so I'm sold on the idea of going ahead and replacing the fuel pump(s). The in-bed tank though is a no-go at this point. While I would REALLY love the extended range of a large tank, I regularly haul large loads of fresh logs. I just can't give up 2' of bed space permanently. I have a toolbox that I can take out and get a good 20% more wood in the bed. I would consider a narrow maybe 8-10" wide tank the entire width of the bed, as long as I could get a 4x8' sheet of plywood or an 8' 2x4"underneath it, as in bolted up off of the bottom of the bed. My current toolbox is a deep-well one, with about 4" of space underneath it.


So, after putting the pumps in, what controls them?? I mean, the stock pump pumps faster as the engine revs higher. I don't understand the setup--I know the IDM tells the injectors to open & how far, but what is telling the electric fuel pump to pump faster if it's a dead-end setup?????
Do what you gotta do, but the midship tanks are not going to serve you very well for VO. Trust me

They SD pump pumps the same volume and pressure at any RPM. It requires a return fuel line back to tank.
The FASS has a built in regulator, which goes into bypass when there is aduquate fuel, and maintains the pressure you set.

All this is assuming both of these truck are NOT IDI trucks.....This is the set up for 94.5-2003 7.3's.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now

In order to be able to post messages on the Ford Powerstroke Diesel Forum forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.
User Name:
If you do not want to register, fill this field only and the name will be used as user name for your post.
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.
Password:
Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.
Email Address:

Log-in

Human Verification

In order to verify that you are a human and not a spam bot, please enter the answer into the following box below based on the instructions contained in the graphic.



Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On



All times are GMT -8. The time now is 03:04 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.6.1
Garage Plus, Vendor Tools vBulletin Plugins by Drive Thru Online, Inc.

vB.Sponsors