DP Tuner and your Transmission

[jroller]

Ive got a Dp F5, 4" turbo back, intake, CCV mod, gauges. After discussing this with a local grease monkey, is it better for your trans to drive around all day in 80hp econo?
I understand that there is less "layover" between gear changes and the shifts are much firmer, which should create less heat. Just wondering if the firm, jaring shift, could be worse than the long, smooth, stock shift. Does anybody see a difference in trany temps between the stock and 80hp econo?

[samiam]

Disclaimer statement: I really don't know much about this stuff.
I drive around in-town lately in 40T. The TC locks up sooner in the 40T under acceleration. Shifts seem firmer/quicker for me in the 40T. I don't remember a difference in MPG between the two in-town. I suppose I should talk to Jody and see if I'm good to go. Also, when i'm hovering just above and below the 35 MPH mark for more than a block or two I usually turn of the overdrive so it keeps the TC locked down to 30mph. I just hate the feeling of the TC unlocking, then locking again when i get back up to 35 mph.
Hey jroller, you should fill out a signature block with your upgrades so you don't have to keep letting folks know your mods.
Update: so tonight on the way home (8 mile drive through town) i put it in 80E and felt the power. It really is quicker from a stop. i think i'll keep it in 80e for a few weeks.

[Dirk]

Anytime you add power, your trans gets hotter. Exception? All *GOOD* tuners will raise the line pressures to help keep slipping down. They will also change the shift points depending on what tune you are running.

One tune is not "better" than another. All trucks are different, talk to your tuner and have them adjust the tune to your truck. If I put your chip in my truck, I'm sure it would shift/run like crap. If you installed any of mine, it would be harsh and you would hate the road manners.

[jroller]

Hey jroller, you should fill out a signature block with your upgrades so you don't have to keep letting folks know your mods.
*good call*
Yeah not only does its shift much firmer it downshifts like a manual. Before my downshifts were undectable and now you definatley know its downshifting through every gear.

[jroller]

Originally Posted by Dirk

Anytime you add power, your trans gets hotter. Exception? All *GOOD* tuners will raise the line pressures to help keep slipping down. They will also change the shift points depending on what tune you are running.

One tune is not "better" than another. All trucks are different, talk to your tuner and have them adjust the tune to your truck. If I put your chip in my truck, I'm sure it would shift/run like crap. If you installed any of mine, it would be harsh and you would hate the road manners.

True. I guess I am just trying to prolong the inevidable transmission rebuild.

[Strictly Diesel]

Just my $.02 but with DP programming the shifts should not be "jarring". Jodys trans tuning yields some of the most consistent and smooth shifts while still being quicker and firmer than stock. If you are having "jarring" shifts, there may be something else going on.

Case in point. We did a chip in a 2002 truck a while back. In "stock" it seemed to shift ok, typical sloppy stock shifting. In any program with significant power increase the shifts (one in particular) were downright violent. At first we figured that the truck had unknown valve body work since it had been purchased used, so I had Jody adjust the tuning accordingly (as he would with a BTS, SunCoast or trans with TransGo kit). This involved reducing the programmed line pressure increase since we were assuming that the trans/valve body already had it turned up. Guess what...NO CHANGE...still shifted violently. We tried adjusting this several times in the programming and finally came to the conclusion that it wasn't something we could program out. We ended up making a call to John Wood and driving the truck to him to get the trans looked at. As soon as we described the symptoms he told us it had a stock valve body and the clutches were worn and not doing their job. This was over the phone, without looking at the truck. When he pulled the trans down, he was 100% right, clutches were toast. After he rebuilt it and we put the original program back in, shifting was perfect.

So, why were the shifts so hard with worn clutches, even with reduced line pressures? With the extra power of the chip the trans would slip very badly during shifts (the one in particular). This slippage would occur for about a second until the clutches generated a bunch of friction and heat and then grabbed like nobodys business (SLAM!). It wasn't a firm shift...it was SSSLLLIIIIPPPPPP....BANG! Like most people would, we felt initially that the problem was the trans programming in the chip. In reality, it was the extra power of he chip and the poor internal condition of the trans. I have found this same situation in a bunch of customers trucks since. If you're putting a chip in a well worn trans and getting overly harsh shifts (particularly from a programmer that is known for having fantastic trans shifting), there is a good chance that there are other factors involved. Before you blame your programmer, consider the above.

As a side note, it should be mentioned that the above can happen in varying severities. Some have had shifts I would call "overly firm" where others had "VIOLENT" shifts. The difference was the condition of the trans, with the "VIOLENT" behavior coming from the more worn units. For the situation where the issue is at the less severe end of the spectrum, upgrading the valve body to a unit that mechanically helps improve the shifting can reduce the problem and offer some additional trans life. This is particularly true of the 02-03 trucks, and is the primary reason I've been working with JW to offer his valve body setups. This isn't a "FIX" if you've got significant internal wear, but it can buy you some time before you need to do a rebuild. If the trans is in good shape, it can certainly buy you some peace of mind and longevity by making sure that the shifts work as they are supposed to.

Hope that helps.

[jroller]

Originally Posted by ITPDiesel

Just my $.02 but with DP programming the shifts should not be "jarring". Jodys trans tuning yields some of the most consistent and smooth shifts while still being quicker and firmer than stock. If you are having "jarring" shifts, there may be something else going on.

Case in point. We did a chip in a 2002 truck a while back. In "stock" it seemed to shift ok, typical sloppy stock shifting. In any program with significant power increase the shifts (one in particular) were downright violent. At first we figured that the truck had unknown valve body work since it had been purchased used, so I had Jody adjust the tuning accordingly (as he would with a BTS, SunCoast or trans with TransGo kit). This involved reducing the programmed line pressure increase since we were assuming that the trans/valve body already had it turned up. Guess what...NO CHANGE...still shifted violently. We tried adjusting this several times in the programming and finally came to the conclusion that it wasn't something we could program out. We ended up making a call to John Wood and driving the truck to him to get the trans looked at. As soon as we described the symptoms he told us it had a stock valve body and the clutches were worn and not doing their job. This was over the phone, without looking at the truck. When he pulled the trans down, he was 100% right, clutches were toast. After he rebuilt it and we put the original program back in, shifting was perfect.

So, why were the shifts so hard with worn clutches, even with reduced line pressures? With the extra power of the chip the trans would slip very badly during shifts (the one in particular). This slippage would occur for about a second until the clutches generated a bunch of friction and heat and then grabbed like nobodys business (SLAM!). It wasn't a firm shift...it was SSSLLLIIIIPPPPPP....BANG! Like most people would, we felt initially that the problem was the trans programming in the chip. In reality, it was the extra power of he chip and the poor internal condition of the trans. I have found this same situation in a bunch of customers trucks since. If you're putting a chip in a well worn trans and getting overly harsh shifts (particularly from a programmer that is known for having fantastic trans shifting), there is a good chance that there are other factors involved. Before you blame your programmer, consider the above.

As a side note, it should be mentioned that the above can happen in varying severities. Some have had shifts I would call "overly firm" where others had "VIOLENT" shifts. The difference was the condition of the trans, with the "VIOLENT" behavior coming from the more worn units. For the situation where the issue is at the less severe end of the spectrum, upgrading the valve body to a unit that mechanically helps improve the shifting can reduce the problem and offer some additional trans life. This is particularly true of the 02-03 trucks, and is the primary reason I've been working with JW to offer his valve body setups. This isn't a "FIX" if you've got significant internal wear, but it can buy you some time before you need to do a rebuild. If the trans is in good shape, it can certainly buy you some peace of mind and longevity by making sure that the shifts work as they are supposed to.

Hope that helps.

Good info thanks. This transmission was replaced by Ford about 7k ago, so I dont think thats the case here. As a matter of fact when I take it from 80hp to the 160 aggressive it shifts even harder and chirps the tires in the first couple of gears. I think I need to ride in another truck with the 80hp tune, it may be absolutely normal. Lastly in stock form I dont notice the trans downshifting, on my 80hp I feel EVERY one.

[Strictly Diesel]

Chirping the tires isn't normal for any DP tune. Even my race tune, with "on/off" lockup, firmer shifts and a totally built trans only chirps if I'm in a corner (stupid locker). Your shifts sound overly firm, I can't offer a reason unless there is something done to the valve body that is not currently known.

[jroller]

Originally Posted by ITPDiesel

Chirping the tires isn't normal for any DP tune. Even my race tune, with "on/off" lockup, firmer shifts and a totally built trans only chirps if I'm in a corner (stupid locker). Your shifts sound overly firm, I can't offer a reason unless there is something done to the valve body that is not currently known.

Really? Well allow me to enlighten you. See below (F5 Dp Tuner) video brought to you by the very knowledgable Maintain. Pay close attention to the tires chirping between shifts.

Diesel Movies - I install a DPTuner F5 chip in my buddies truck. Positions were Stock hi idle 60tow 80econo 120 race 140smoke.

[henrymiller1]

Originally Posted by jroller

Good info thanks. This transmission was replaced by Ford about 7k ago, so I dont think thats the case here. As a matter of fact when I take it from 80hp to the 160 aggressive it shifts even harder and chirps the tires in the first couple of gears. I think I need to ride in another truck with the 80hp tune, it may be absolutely normal. Lastly in stock form I dont notice the trans downshifting, on my 80hp I feel EVERY one.

I have a 2000 F250 w/ a new trans from Ford and and new DPTune. I'm in Md, Bring it over, i'd like to try the 160. I have the 80E tune and can feel every downshift. Its smooth, but noticeable. If you have any questions about how mine drives/shifts, i'm happy to help.