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Old 12-17-2012, 12:36 PM
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Clutch Engagement Issues

I drove home after work with no issues or clutch problems. The next morning I get in to start it and the clutch pedal falls to the floor with no resistance. So I look over all the hydraulics and see the slave cylinder is leaking and the reservoir on the master is empty. I picked up a new slave from NAPA (the black plastic one) and bled it from the bottom up cycling the slave and pushing air out of the top. After I reinstalled the slave and checked my pedal I wasn't getting a solid feel, it was real soft for half of the stroke down and then got firm on the bottom half. So I pulled the slave back off and cycled a few more times to see if any air was still in the line. I did this multiple times and realized it was pulling air into the system somehow. Thinking it could be the master pulling air in, I picked up a new one from advance this morning (cast aluminum china crap), NAPA wasn't in stock. Got it on and bled out with no air in the system. Some things I noticed while under the dash was the rod for the new master is 2 inches shorter, the rod that was on the truck was threaded and adjustable. I ended up trying the adjustable rod so I don't have to re-clock the pedal arm. I had to adjust it out pretty tight to get a solid pedal but was able to. After all this madness the pedal still doesn't feel satisfactory and truck won't go into gear. Can anyone point me in the right direction to figure this out? The pedal assembly up top does have a small amount of wear and play but don't think it's enough to cause this issue. I don't know very much about the dual mass flywheel to know if it can cause issues like this. The truck has 192k mi. on the clock and not sure when a clutch was put in. I've only owned it for 11k mi and 6 months. I don't want to think it's a clutch problem itself but at this point i'm thinking it's a possibility. Thanks for any input
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Old 12-18-2012, 05:22 AM
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Get under the truck with a tape measure while an assistant works the pedal. The end of the fork should move about 1/2" to 9/16". If it is moving that much, the problem is "downstream" - bent fork, pressure plate, something else inside the clutch. If you have less travel than that, then it's "upstream" - hydraulics, pedal box bushings, etc.

Is the eyelet on that original pushrod ovalized? Are you still using the craptastic plastic bushing in there?

If it looks like the hydraulics, your best bet might be (sorry to say this after you bought the master and slave) a complete pre-built pre-bled master-line-slave assembly. Installs in minutes with no bleeding. Costs about as much as a separate master and slave, if not a bit less.
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Old 12-18-2012, 06:28 AM
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The eyelet was is good condition, there was a plastic bushing in it and was almost wore out. Also it was held on by thin wire just wrapped around the shaft. I put the new bushing on for the time being and put a drill stop on the shaft.

As for the clutch pedal feel, I can see that my pedal box will need attention in the near future. A fair amount of slop was in it and I adjusted the rod for my master to pick up the slack. It will go in gear now. Headed to the body shop now, should have been there yesterday.

Does anyone make rebuild kits for the pedal box assembly or have to buy the whole thing new?
New 1992 1997 Ford F 250 F 350 Brake Clutch Pedal Assembly Bracket Spring | eBay

Thanks madpogue
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Old 12-18-2012, 06:58 AM
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Blocked from eBay where I am now. You can get the pedal box bushing kit at the dealer, I wanna say it was $20-ish. That's probably all it needs. Fah, part number is at home.

Adjustable pushrod is nice to have; a lot easier / more foolproof than re-clocking the arm. I just got one for our '85 IDI (pushrod just pops out of the master); the existing one was way ovalized, Like night and day.

Edit - that plastic bushing on the eyelet won't last. Since the eyelet's not ovalized, a more sturdy solution would be a short section of 1/2"OD x 7/16"ID brass tubing as a bushing, and then retain that drill stop collar. Or you could go fancy with the Heim joint. Problem with the plastic bushing is that when it wears out, you might still have some good pedal action, but then it's metal-on-metal between the arm shaft and the eyelet, and that's what ovalizes the eyelet eventually.

Last edited by madpogue; 12-18-2012 at 09:19 AM.
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Old 12-18-2012, 03:05 PM
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Good deal, I will definitely check into the bushing kit. It's weird seeing the brake pedal move out when you push the clutch in. If your able to find the part number that would be great, aren't there some guys on here that can order factory fresh parts for us?

Where did you find your adjustable pushrod? Mine just happened to be on the truck already and reused on the new M/C. I had to tighten it up real nice though to get the slack out of the pedal box. I know brass is a fairly soft material but have folks had some success with using it on this application? If I still worked at a machine shop I would def make a one piece drill stop and bushing.

I didn't have a chance or a helper to measure my clutch fork movement but I'm curious. When it gets back from the body shop at the end of the week I will check. It went through all gears fairly well today but did have one instance where it didn't wanna go into first, but did go into first later in the trip. It's my main work truck and I'm self employed so this baby's gotta stay on it's feet. Thanks again for the help
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Old 12-18-2012, 05:24 PM
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The adjustable rod I got was an ATP FX231 ; just north of $9, and <$2 shipping. But it's got a ball end where it pops into the master; I got it for the '85, and IIRC, the '95-up had a groove that snaps into a snap ring in the master. I don't know if anyone makes an adjustable rod for the "later" trucks. You might get that one to work, though.

If it gives you grief again, and you find that multiple pumps of the pedal help, that suggests a lingering hydraulic issue; perhaps air still in the system. You're not alone in finding these things a b!+c# to bleed; I went through that when the slave (or was it the master?) failed on the first truck. When it failed on the second truck, I opted for the pre-built kit.

I did manage to get the first one bled by a somewhat unorthodox method, though. There's enough play in the fork that you can push on it, and with the hydraulics hooked up, it'll push backward on the slave rod and push fluid up through the system. So I opened the cap on the master, and had my wife monitor the fluid while I back-pushed on the fork from underneath. She saw bubbles for several minutes of pushing; then it was just a sort of "wave" of fluid, with no air bubbles. I figured that was as good as I was gonna get it, and it's worked fine since.
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Old 12-19-2012, 09:51 AM
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Clutch/Brake Pedal Box Bushing Kit
(Ford) F3TZ-2C342-A

Cheers!
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Old 12-21-2012, 02:49 PM
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Thanks for the part number Patrick, my local dealer actually had the kit in stock. I was very surprised, 25 bucks out the door.
I didn't have a helper during the bleeding process so I compromised with technology and used my phone lying on the cowl to shoot video of what was going on inside the master reservoir! Don't push to hard or you'll squirt the phone. LOL
Truck's back from the body shop as of today, now i'll conquer the bushing kit.
Any words of wisdom? Thanks again
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Old 12-22-2012, 10:59 AM
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LOL, when I had to bleed ours, my wife was pretty sick, and I actually thought about some similar trick with the digital camera looking at the master. Fortunately she had the strength to come out and help.

Pedal box bushings - you have to disconnect the steering column/shaft universal and push the shaft down for the box to clear. Lots of patience, and just fiddle with the angles, getting the box out. Then just note the relative position of the pedal and the lever arm (maybe take a pic), so it's in the same position when you put it together. Take the nut of either end of the shaft, you don't need to take off both.
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