egr delete or bpd cooler - Ford Powerstroke Diesel Forum
6.0L Performance Parts Discussion What has or has not worked for you?

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post #1 of 4 Old 05-28-2013, 06:24 PM Thread Starter Fanatic
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egr delete or bpd cooler

While researching bullet proofing the 6.0 I came up on a controversial question, delete or new cooler? I see many upsides to the delete but one major one for the bps egr cooler, no known failures! Is this true??? What have people had luck with? Not making a hauler more of a toy so not really gonna beat on it...I'm religious about maintenance too, I just wanna spend the $ the right way the first time and have a long lasting truck
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post #2 of 4 Old 05-29-2013, 06:15 AM
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Yeah I am going to go with their egr cooler when I do their oil kit. I have read no where and or talked to senior about failures. Senior said if it fails its life time warranty on the part.

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post #3 of 4 Old 05-29-2013, 06:33 AM
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After talking to the guys at BPD I went with their cooler set up. But now after many rethinking session's I wish I had just deleted the whole mess.
#1 Your still pumping trash into your intake via.exhaust. There is a reason why we try to get this out and away from the motor. Why do we take so many steps in making sure the air coming into the motor is clean fresh and cool and then dump hot exhaust back in???
#2 It dirty's up your oil. Id love to go with the BPD secondary oil cooler set up but heck if Im dumping trash into the motor I cant ask the small seconday filter to clean it. But if I didnt have the egr system cruddin up the system the secondary oil filter would reeley help out.
Just my thoughts

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post #4 of 4 Old 05-29-2013, 09:15 AM
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Here's a little food for though.. I plan on keeping mine and upgrading to a BPD cooler when the time comes. As a member of a different Ford related website guys were pulling/plugging/removing/disabling their EGR systems, quite a few of them complaining that they were not getting the results they expected, and then one day a guy posts this. Taken with a grain of salt as this deals with mechanical systems (carbs/distributors) and not FICM/ECM/ICP/HPOP that we are used to, but you get the gist.
Originally Posted by Seattle Smitty
"Are you smarter than the Ford factory" is just one of two questions to ask, the other being, "If the Ford factory had built the engine for best efficiency in all regimes (incl. part-throttle cruise) WITHOUT having to meet any emissions requirements, would they have used EGR?" The answer to that is no. Mixing an inert gas (recirculated exhaust) with the intake charge makes the engine less efficient in any circumstance. There seems to be an idea that because EGR only works during part-throttle operation, it therefore can't hurt anything. That's wrong; if the factory had built the engine without EGR, without the inert gas, it would make a given level of part-throttle power with less fuel. If you want more efficiency than the factory built into the engine, you can make a number of non-factory modifictions, one of which would certainly be deleting the EGR. But as I keep saying to those who insist that EGR "doesn't hurt", if you think you can run better with inert gas in your intake charge, why not install a bottle of argon?

HOWEVER, repeat HOWEVER, if you do make engine changes, pretty much ANY engine changes, the question, "Are you smarter" then applies with a vengeance. The factory, having had to employ EGR, spent a lot of dyno and track time fine-tuning the engine FOR THAT CONFIGURATION. In deleting the EGR, or doing ANY OTHER ENGINE MODIFICATION, you put your engine outside of the factory's expert tuning program . . . your engine is OUT OF TUNE. This is why people here and elsewhere frequently report disappointment with mods that should have worked better than they did . A huge range of tuning knowledge and awareness exists in our little world, from clueless to expert. The fact that you can spin a wrench and remove or install something says nothing about your ability to tune your engine for the change(s) you make. I like to think I know something about this, but am fully aware that I could know an awful lot more.

Come to think of it, there is a part B to the, "Are you smarter" question, and that is, "If you ARE smart enough that you could re-tune your engine to take reasonably full advantage of its now-not-factory configuration, do you have the tools to do it?" Tachometer, vacuum guage, dial-back-to-zero timing light, a compression gauge and maybe a blowdown guage to make sure the engine is basically healthy, a set of jets and emulsion tubes and needles and powervalves and what-not, an adjustable vacuum advancer and sets of distributor springs and weights, even an air-fuel meter, I'm surely forgetting things here, . . . and then can you afford and get dyno-time (and do you know how to USE dyno time?), or do you at least have a long, straight, even, lightly-traveled uphill grade to use as a poor-man's dyno (and do you know how to use that?), or do you have a local dragstrip (and do you know how to use that?). And do you have time, T I M E, plenty of time, to tune?

Because if you can't say yes to most of that, then you can't really do a good job re-tuning the changes you make from factory, and thus the effectiveness of your changes will be a matter of luck.

I don't write this from any position of superiority. I am driving a car every day that I fully rebuilt and modified significantly (incl. EGR delete, for reasons not important here), and it is not getting nearly the mpg I intend for it, chiefly because I haven't had any time to go through a good tuning program. Maybe this summer, and I am looking forward to the tuning exercise, which I feel is not a chore but a fun intellectual challenge for any good amateur rodder. Until then, my car performs less well than a factory-stock car would, even though everything I did has the potential to be an improvement; the current state of tune is that far out, even though the car runs reasonably smoothly and without drama.
So the questions I have to ask myself are not if "I" am smarter than a Ford engineer, but if the guy who writes the custom tune to turn off the EGR function is smarter than a Ford Engineer. Simply commanding it OFF is not the full solution. And if you read on here you will find that a lot of people are switching from one guys tunes to another and claiming that their truck likes one better than another, I'm not saying that any Tuner is better than another, but if a company/tuner gets lucky and hits parameters that your truck likes, then I feel that you got lucky. Some of the posts I read on here there are guys that try multiple tunes from multiple vendors and are never satisfied, they eventually 'settle'. I've been chatting with another member on here via PM's and I like his current philosophy. Better to have it and disable it, than to NOT have it an need it.
Since yours is an 05 if you delete the EGR you will need a ecm tuner like an SCT with custom tunes to turn the EGR function off. If you don't and just use the EGR delete with a stock ECM file it will throw CELs for EGR flow issues and can cause other issues.
That's why I just decided to upgrade the cooler and disable the EGR valve. So I can go both ways with out turning a wrench.
We know that the EGR and CCV systems are not on the engines for peak performance, but getting rid of them needs to be done in a way that is still safe for the motor and environment (in the case of the CCV)

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