MTW Stage 1 vs. Stage 2 vs. Stock all on my truck. - Ford Powerstroke Diesel Forum
6.0L Performance Parts Discussion What has or has not worked for you?

Powerstroke.org is the premier Diesel Truck Forum on the internet. Registered Users do not see the above ads.
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 07-01-2012, 06:44 PM
Powerstroke.org Sponsor
 

Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Dallas, GA
Posts: 5,800
Thanks: 79
Thanked 136 Times in 91 Posts
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
MTW Stage 1 vs. Stage 2 vs. Stock all on my truck.

Well, I've gone from a stock turbo to a Stage 2, back to stock (after Bill at PHP stole my Stage 2) and I'm now running a Stage 1. All my testing has been done on a 2006 F250 ECLB 4x4 w/5R110 on 35's. My mods are as follows. S&B CAI, 58v QuickTricks FICM with PHP tuning, MBRP 4" straight pipe, 6.4L banjo's and custom tunes from Quick Tricks, TSD and IDP, stock injectors and fuel delivery. There are sh*tloads of other mods on the truck, but I feel that these are the important ones pertaining to the turbo performance.

I'll begin by saying that the Stage 1 & 2 are miles above the stocker. My truck loves the extra air and runs smoother, faster and gets better fuel economy on both turbo's. Both of these turbo's used the 13 blade turbine wheel so the exhaust note changed very little. The intake however does have a more pronounced whistle, but not enough to annoy my pregnant wife, so I'm gonna say it's very tolerable.

OK the Stage 1. This IMHO is a very nice turbo for someone who wants more power, but will never go beyond stock or 155/stock-30over injectors. The reason I say stock -155's is that this turbo will completely clean up the smoke from these injectors and keep the EGT's well within acceptable limits. This turbo will provide quicker boost with no dead spots and lower EGT's. Over the stock turbo I've noticed a 100+ degree drop in EGT's, BUT REMEMBER, I am running the Hercules 100 FICM tune. This tune removes all fueling restrictions on the low end so it is a HOT FICM tune. Any other FICM tune would see noticeably lower EGT's, closer to 200*+ (from what others have consistently reported). The back pressure has been between 1.27:1 and 1.41:1. This turbo has netted a 2mpg gain over the stocker that just came off. The power is good and the truck is noticeably faster, especially on the bottom end. Getting out in traffic is not a problem. This turbo made 473RWHP on the PHP dyno in 80*+ heat and high humidity on a Gearhead tune designed for the stock turbo. The Stage 1 will run on whatever tunes you already have (including stock) without any issues and noticeably more power, but some tweaking of the tune will further benefit performance. The tuning is still being worked out and we'll have more on that soon. As soon as I get a tune for these turbo's that I'm happy with, I'll let anyone interested know who to call and what to ask for. As for towing with the Stage 1, I havn't done any yet but will this week, however it won't be horribly heavy until I change this FICM tune.

The Stage 2. The thing is beautiful. I was extremely impressed with this turbo. The power was noticeably higher than the Stage 1. This turbo cleaned up whatever tunes I threw at it. The EGT's were 200*+ cooler than stock on all my tunes. It doesn't spool as fast as the Stage 1, but is still as quick to light as stock if not a shade quicker. Back pressure was between 1.16:1 and 1.35:1 depnding on the tune I was running. My truck produced 485RWHP with this turbo on PHP's dyno. The ambient air temp was 80+ and very high humidity. This turbo has produced 560RWHP on a truck with 190/75's in 90*+ heat on PHP's dyno. I believe this turbo could be used on naything from stock to 190/50's (some smoke at WOT) with great success. This thing is moving the air boys and girls. I was also able to net 23.5+MPG (highway driving 60-65mph with a little stop and go through a couple small towns) before I took it off the truck on a QT Looney Wild track file. The power was unbelievable. I could destroy the rear tires with no effort, but the truck remained as streetable as the day it rolled off the line until you squashed the skinny pedal. Again, this turbo will run on whatever tunes you already have (including stock), and run well, but will benefit from some tweaking in the tuning. The turbo exhibited very little lag, no surging and smooth consistent power throughout the RPM range. The truck cruised faster with less effort and was overall much happier with the Stage 2 over stock. I did tow with this turbo as well. 14K behind the truck and the turbo performed flawlessly. The load moved quicker and was held at speed easier with far less down shifting. I was running a IDP Agressive tow file with turbo brake for this test. My EGT's stayed below 1150* (ATLAS 80 FICM tune) the entire run. Ambient air temps were in the mid to upper 80's with normal GA humidity. The Stage 2 is a 64.7x88mm compressor wheel in a .72AR housing with a .90AR turbine housing. The new Hybrid turbo that will be debuting within the next week or two will be a 64.7x88mm compressor wheel in a .58AR housing with a .90ARturbine housing. The expected HP difference is 5-8 in favor of the Stage 2, but the price difference is looking to be fairly large. For these reasons the Stage 2 may soon be replaced by the Hybrid if the testing goes well and it performs as expected. As soon as I get the Hybrid you guys will get a review of it as well.

I've tried to give you the best reviews as possible with all the info I have, but please feel free to ask any questions you want.

Last edited by MWilbur516; 07-02-2012 at 06:46 PM.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
  #2  
Old 07-01-2012, 09:14 PM
Compression Ignition Addict
 

Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Evans, Louisiana
Posts: 583
Thanks: 6
Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
So the Stage 2 is better all around for a stock injector truck? I don't think I'll ever upgrade my injectors but I'd love more fuel economy and lower EGTs...
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #3  
Old 07-01-2012, 09:50 PM
Member
 

Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 43
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
nice its looking like i should just hold on to my 6.0 instead of goin 6.4. doesnt seem like to much work to get them as fast as the 6.4 with these new turbos out, but i do like there interiors
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #4  
Old 07-02-2012, 08:33 AM
The Silent Service

 

Join Date: Dec 2010
Posts: 5,210
Thanks: 0
Thanked 29 Times in 8 Posts
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Quote:
Originally Posted by MWilbur516 View Post
Well, I've gone from a stock turbo to a Stage 2, back to stock (after Bill at PHP stole my Stage 2) and I'm now running a Stage 1. All my testing has been done on a 2006 F250 ECLB 4x4 w/5R110 on 35's.

. . .

The intake however does have a more pronounced whistle, but not enough to annoy my pregnant wife, so I'm gonna say it's very tolerable.

. . .
The Stage 2. The thing is beautiful. I was extremely impressed with this turbo. The power was noticeably higher than the Stage 1. This turbo cleaned up whatever tunes I threw at it. The EGT's were 200*+ cooler than stock on all my tunes. It doesn't spool as fast as the Stage 1, but is still as quick to light as stock if not a shade quicker. . . This thing is moving the air boys and girls. I was also able to net 23.5+MPG (highway driving 60-65mph with a little stop and go through a couple small towns) before I took it off the truck on a QT Looney Wild track file. . .Again, this turbo will run on whatever tunes you already have (including stock), and run well, but will benefit from some tweaking in the tuning. . . I did tow with this turbo as well. 14K behind the truck and the turbo performed flawlessly. The load moved quicker and was held at speed easier with far less down shifting. I was running a IDP Agressive tow file with turbo brake for this test. My EGT's stayed below 1150* (ATLAS 80 FICM tune) the entire run. Ambient air temps were in the mid to upper 80's with normal GA humidity.. . .

I've tried to give you the best reviews as possible with all the info I have, but please feel free to ask any questions you want.
Thanks for these numbers, particularly with the Towing figures. That's a good sized load for the tuning you had loaded, and I'm glad the Stage 2 works for you.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Country Mav View Post
So the Stage 2 is better all around for a stock injector truck? I don't think I'll ever upgrade my injectors but I'd love more fuel economy and lower EGTs...
Sounds like the Stage 2 is a great stock-injector option. Just weigh the cost benefit of the Stage 2 vs the new Hybrid that's under development. The only real difference will be the housing it sounds like (.58 A/R vs the .74 A/R of the Stage 2). It should be moving similar amounts of air to the Stage 2 and cost a few hundred less. I'm waiting for the testing results on the Hybrid myself, though I'm leaning toward the Stage 2 in my tow build.

Quote:
Originally Posted by villain View Post
nice its looking like i should just hold on to my 6.0 instead of goin 6.4. doesnt seem like to much work to get them as fast as the 6.4 with these new turbos out, but i do like there interiors
These new turbos are breathing a new life into the 6.0L. Its had great injector options, but these are the first turbos to really be able to take advantage of them.

Last edited by colo_dually; 07-02-2012 at 08:39 AM.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #5  
Old 07-02-2012, 09:02 AM
Compression Ignition Addict
 

Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Somewhere around Atlanta
Posts: 3,341
Thanks: 0
Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Will be waiting for the Hybrid vs. Stage 2
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #6  
Old 07-02-2012, 09:15 AM
Compression Ignition Addict
 

Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: SoCal
Posts: 680
Thanks: 2
Thanked 2 Times in 1 Post
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
I am really interested in the Stage2 but this hybrid has caught my eye now. I have read pretty much every thread that has to do with these turbos, but there is so many that I get lost and confused. So all of these turbos need my stock turbo to be modified? What is used off my turbo? Can a Pmax be modified into a Stage2? When it is said that there is a 200* drop in egts, is that throughout the entire power band? Do the egts dropped that much on WOT too?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #7  
Old 07-02-2012, 09:39 AM
BACKYARDIGAN


 

Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Huntington, WV
Posts: 4,697
Thanks: 29
Thanked 93 Times in 66 Posts
Feedback Score: 2 reviews
Great review Matt I can't wait to hear how the "Hybrid" works out for ya.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #8  
Old 07-02-2012, 10:43 AM
Powerstroke.org Fanatic
 

Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Breslau, Ontario
Posts: 118
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Feedback Score: 2 reviews
Outstanding review!! Great information! I am one of those who are between the 1 and 2. I will be looking forward to the hybrid review! I assume you are running stock injectors? Not to get off topic, but are you able to to run the 100 Hercules with Gearhead tunes and stock injectors?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #9  
Old 07-02-2012, 04:15 PM
Premium Member

 

Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 1,515
Thanks: 2
Thanked 33 Times in 23 Posts
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Quote:
Originally Posted by new2deisel View Post
I am really interested in the Stage2 but this hybrid has caught my eye now. I have read pretty much every thread that has to do with these turbos, but there is so many that I get lost and confused. So all of these turbos need my stock turbo to be modified? What is used off my turbo? Can a Pmax be modified into a Stage2? When it is said that there is a 200* drop in egts, is that throughout the entire power band? Do the egts dropped that much on WOT too?
The drop of egt is through out the whole rpm band, the turbo pushes that much more air. Great write up, and I know that there are alot of threads and hard to keep track of them, sorry about that.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #10  
Old 07-02-2012, 05:34 PM
Compression Ignition Addict
 

Join Date: May 2012
Location: Ft. Myers, FL
Posts: 185
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Feedback Score: 1 reviews
Thanx for the great review! I'm trying to soak this up as fast a you guys put it out! I'm also interested in the hybrid cause as of right now I'm thinking stage 2 with 175's but it's going to be a few months before I pull the trigger. I look forward to hearing more.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I777 using AutoGuide.Com Free App
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now

In order to be able to post messages on the Ford Powerstroke Diesel Forum forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.
User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.
Password:
Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.
Email Address:

Log-in

Human Verification

In order to verify that you are a human and not a spam bot, please enter the answer into the following box below based on the instructions contained in the graphic.



Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On



All times are GMT -8. The time now is 10:42 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.6.1
Garage Plus, Vendor Tools vBulletin Plugins by Drive Thru Online, Inc.

vB.Sponsors