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Arp Studs + Black Onyx= FAIL

6K views 37 replies 21 participants last post by  wick89gt 
#1 ·
I had my truck studded with black onyx gaskets about a 1 1/2 years & 27K miles ago...this was done by a really big ford dealer and they "checked the heads" but didn't have them machined.

So I started puking really bad so I got a block tester and she went green really quick. It also seems to be a little down on power.

My question is if I have someone that really knows what they are doing I.E BTS Brains Truck Shop do the studs with oe gaskets and he always decks the heads will I still have problems in the future if I want 550rwhp?

I can't afford to keep studding this DANG truck.

Maybe I dont make enough money to own a ford:dunno:

Or should I get it fixed and just sell it?
 
#2 ·
It doesnt matter what gaskets you use IMO if you dont properly check the heads. They MUST be FLAT. So regardless of what else gets done, they have to be checked for flatness and sealing. IMO if you install a set of heads that are checked for flatness, sealing, magnafluxed and a new valve job performed; you should be fine. I would also recommend oem head gaskets as a personal opinion. Hope this helps.
 
#3 ·
Sorry to hear about that, man. It's exactly what was said in the post above. The deck surfaces MUST BE FLAT or you are asking for problems. In addition, the black onyx gaskets just shouldn't be used. Most folks who have used them report the same kind of problems. Compare that to mine, which has been running 70k miles with ARP studs and OEM gaskets. Done correctly, they can last a LONG time. Best of luck in your decision. :thumb:
 
#4 ·
Unfortunately, the Ford procedure for checking the heads is not sufficient (as you learned). The only thing they do is check the flatness with a straight edge and a feeler gauge over a few areas. No magnafluxing, no hardened valve seats installed, nothing else.
With the proper head and block prep, the head gaskets should last the life of the engine, even with 550 RWHP.
 
#5 ·
Being the knowledgeable person that you are:thumb:

have you heard of anyone popping OEM gaskets & studs when the heads were machined? If so what power level?
 
#7 ·
And while it's apart again. Have the block surface checked for flatness as well as the heads.

I went through the stud adventure when people were still saying the black onyx gaskets were the stuff. At the time, I got the oem's because the dealer only charged me $100. Said they had a mixed up order come in and these were extra.

BTW, that's a heart sinking feeling when that stuff happens. Sorry to hear that. Hope you get'er fixed and going again.
 
#8 ·
Black Onyx or Ford gaskets doesn't matter. If the job was done wrong, its going to fail. I know guys that have twin turbo kits on thier 6.0s with Black Onyx gaskets and sled pull with no issues. You cant beat a truck much more than that. Take it to the diesel shop and have them do it right.:thumb:
 
#9 ·
yank the ehads, take them to a machine shop worth their salt, have them magnaflux and check the heads, repair as necessary, use oem gaskets, and bobs ur uncle
 
#10 ·
bobs ur uncle?

Not sure what that means:dunno:
 
#11 ·
it Means you got her dicked !
 
#13 ·
Mines startin to puke with 25000kms on the stud job, i used the black onyx too... heads were checked and planed .002''.
I know ur pain , but i still love the truck no matter how much time and money and problems it has caused me .
 
#14 ·
So after my truck puked the other day I have been taking it easy on it. The other day I put a coolant PSI gauge on it and it was around 7-9psi most of the time and after I was really beating on it was up around 12psi. It never spiked fast like you would expect with a head gasket problem...It also hasnt puked since.

My oil vs coolant deltas are 5-6 deg

So what do you guys think? Are my gaskets gone?

Why would it fail the engine block blue fluid test if the gaskets weren't bad?
 
#15 ·
Update--

Now its puking every time I get on it. I even got a new cap because I was getting the tea kettle whistle on the old cap. It also started burning coolant.

Here is vid. It smoked like this in the morning for about 5 min then this afternoon for about 3 min after sitting for an hour, but then it sat for about 3hrs and didn't smoke at all.

How long can I drive it like this?
 
#17 ·
That smoke is from the bad HGs right? Not a bad injector?
 
#19 ·
6.0's very very very rarely blow coolant into the cylinder from a blown headgasket. Have you smelled the smoke for the "flavor"?
 
#18 ·
I would say head gasket. I had the same issues your having even after new oil cooler, degas bottle, cap and egr delete . Yanked the heads this past weekend and it wasn't pretty. Ford did a head gasket job a few years ago and it never ran 100% after and I know why now lol.
 
#21 ·
If your exhaust smells sweet, there's coolant being burned in the engine and there's only two ways for that to occur - EGR cooler rupture or failed head gaskets.
 
#22 ·
Had my truck done by ford. That was probably a mistake.
 
#23 ·
Mine was done by Ford at a dealership as well. It's really the knowledge of the technician performing the work coupled with what they can get approved by Ford. Even if it isn't approved, they need to know not to follow the Ford procedure and consult a machine shop. Even if the machining comes out of your pocket, it would be FAR cheaper and less hassle to get it done properly the first time.
 
#24 ·
As some have said, if the job is done to Ford spec there can still be failures, if the heads and/or block are not flat. Ford spec for warpage is entirely too generous, its a way out to keep from heads having to be replaced under warranty. Ford spec also to my knowledge says the heads cannot be milled, this is not the case. There can generally be .008 removed from the heads safely, but we have seen up to .020 removed with no valve clearance issues. It all depends on the thickness of your heads from the factory as they do vary. Whatever you decide to do, do yourself a favor and take the heads to a highly reputable machine shop and don't settle for the best value. Ask what type of equipment they will be using. If the machine shop does not have a CNC Mill don't let them surface the heads on a belt type surface grinder. There is no way to meter how much material is being removed on this type of machine, but unfortunately this is the type of equipment that a basic engine machine shop will have. Hopefully I have not confused or overwhelmed you, but if you have any further questions feel free to call or PM. Thanks.
 
#30 ·
I studded and replaced my head gaskets (w/ Black Onyx) in April. Everything regarding flatness checked out fine and I have not had a problem with mine yet (don't have alot of mods though). Anyhow I do remember the Ford manual stating that the heads are not to be milled down; always wondered why it would hurt anything other than possible valve clearance or push rod lengths issues.
 
#25 ·
okay y'all are saying you can get them flattened, what if you buy new oem gaskets instead of having a machine chop do them?
 
#28 ·
What I am saying in a nutshell, is if your block and/or heads are warped, it doesn't matter what gaskets you use, what studs you use, what adhesion promoter you use on the gaskets, or how you even torque them THEY WILL FAIL AGAIN AND AGAIN AND AGAIN if they are not flat.
 
#29 ·
Thanks for the info my truck is in the middle of this repair, having the heads done at a machine shop, they found 7 cylinders with cracks on the intake valve seats, flattening, (.002) new sleeves and a couple of other goodies that i do not remember right now, right at 800.00 with the machine shop. (ouch) How is the block check, is a square used? this is a major repair at a ungodly cost, no short cuts can be taken.
 
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