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  #1  
Old 10-02-2012, 11:22 PM
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2003 F250 Remote start: Wait to start light/door trigger

I've been reading up on the remote start diagrams and such for my 03 F250 and I am trying to figure out what the deal is with the wait to start light? I used to work as a car installer years ago and don't remember this being an issue, but then again, maybe I did not install one into a Ford diesel.

So can I hook up to a wait to start light/wire in the cluster? Or am I forced to use the delay option in the remote start? I would prefer to use some sort of wait to start indication from the truck so that the key on period will adjust according to need.

Also, I'm finding conflicting info on the door triggers. If I have a GEM module, can I still use the one wire in the kick panel? Or will I need to go to each door and diode isolate? I recall having to do a bunch of isolating for the door triggers on my brother's 03 Ranger.

Any info appreciated; Thanks
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Old 10-29-2012, 07:33 AM
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Well, since nobody answered and this has had over 100 views, I guess I should post a follow-up.

I completed my alarm/remote start install this weekend. No problems, it was actually one of the easier installs I've done.

It looks like I do not have to worry about a GEM module in my truck. I found some notes stating to find out if I have a GEM, lock the doors using my remote (or from the door switch would work too, I suppose), wait 5-10 minutes and then reach in and try to unlock by pressing the door lock switch. If it unlocks with one press, I do not have a GEM.

So I went ahead with the assumption that I have no GEM module. My door trigger wire was in the passenger kick panel (Black/blue, + trigger). This worked for all 4 doors. The only issue is that there is a delay on the domelight after you shut the doors (about 20 seconds). I just programmed my alarm to ignore that input right after arming, so not really a big deal.
On my brother's Ranger the GEM module would set off the alarm after 45 minutes, which is why I was asking about the GEM and door triggers. I've had none of that go on either.


For the wait to start, I ended up using the timer setting in my alarm, set to 15 seconds. After reading about the potential damage to the vehicle, I just decided it's not worth the risk. 15 seconds should cover all conditions.

Also, the door locks on my truck were negative trigger because I had a factory keyless entry. Some of the documentation states to get those at the module in the center of the dash. It's kind of a pain to get to those wires, so I checked the driver's side kick panel and found the same wire colors there.

That's about it, if anyone has questions, feel free to ask and I'll do my best to answer.
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Old 11-07-2012, 10:52 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 67rstbkt View Post
Well, since nobody answered and this has had over 100 views, I guess I should post a follow-up.

I completed my alarm/remote start install this weekend. No problems, it was actually one of the easier installs I've done.

It looks like I do not have to worry about a GEM module in my truck. I found some notes stating to find out if I have a GEM, lock the doors using my remote (or from the door switch would work too, I suppose), wait 5-10 minutes and then reach in and try to unlock by pressing the door lock switch. If it unlocks with one press, I do not have a GEM.

So I went ahead with the assumption that I have no GEM module. My door trigger wire was in the passenger kick panel (Black/blue, + trigger). This worked for all 4 doors. The only issue is that there is a delay on the domelight after you shut the doors (about 20 seconds). I just programmed my alarm to ignore that input right after arming, so not really a big deal.
On my brother's Ranger the GEM module would set off the alarm after 45 minutes, which is why I was asking about the GEM and door triggers. I've had none of that go on either.


For the wait to start, I ended up using the timer setting in my alarm, set to 15 seconds. After reading about the potential damage to the vehicle, I just decided it's not worth the risk. 15 seconds should cover all conditions.

Also, the door locks on my truck were negative trigger because I had a factory keyless entry. Some of the documentation states to get those at the module in the center of the dash. It's kind of a pain to get to those wires, so I checked the driver's side kick panel and found the same wire colors there.

That's about it, if anyone has questions, feel free to ask and I'll do my best to answer.
I called a shop a few days ago and they told me I would have to buy a module that attaches to the ignition switch somehow that was an extra $90+ because its diesel. Would this be the wait to start function? Also, I am assuming to find out if I have a GEM, I would leave the windows down, lock the doors with the remote, then after 10 minutes hit the unlock on the door and If it unlocks with one click then I shouldn't need the extra module? I think I would be better visiting the shop and have them look but what is your opinion?
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Old 11-07-2012, 11:28 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bwmtnbiker View Post
I called a shop a few days ago and they told me I would have to buy a module that attaches to the ignition switch somehow that was an extra $90+ because its diesel. Would this be the wait to start function? Also, I am assuming to find out if I have a GEM, I would leave the windows down, lock the doors with the remote, then after 10 minutes hit the unlock on the door and If it unlocks with one click then I shouldn't need the extra module? I think I would be better visiting the shop and have them look but what is your opinion?
If it's the 2003 in your signature, I doubt you will need any extra modules. There are a few interface modules out there depending on the application

1: Factory immobilizer bypass - not needed in a 2003 as there is no factory anti-theft "chip in key"

2: Low tachometer signal - some diesels may need this if the signal output is not strong enough for the alarm (I did not need one on my 2003). This may also have to do with the alarm brand.

As for the wait to start delay, any good alarm/remote start should have this built into the unit. If it does not, I would buy something that does. Why spend another $90 on something that could be built in?

The GEM module, if you happen to have one, should be a matter of wiring. If the installer is unable to figure this out, find someone competent to do the job.

The alarm/remote start I used is a Python 513; I bought it on sale from Sonicelectronix.com for $85, regular price is around $100. It's a good brand, made by DEI, they also make Viper, Clifford, Hornet, Avital, and a bunch of other brands. Does that answer your questions?


I've done a lot of remote starts over the years (the first one I did was around 1996) and my Ford was one of the easiest I've done. It's not that difficult for someone who knows what they are doing and probably only moderately difficult for someone who can figure out how to test and hook up some wiring.

Last edited by 67rstbkt; 11-07-2012 at 11:33 AM.
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Old 11-09-2012, 06:32 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 67rstbkt View Post
If it's the 2003 in your signature, I doubt you will need any extra modules. There are a few interface modules out there depending on the application

1: Factory immobilizer bypass - not needed in a 2003 as there is no factory anti-theft "chip in key"

2: Low tachometer signal - some diesels may need this if the signal output is not strong enough for the alarm (I did not need one on my 2003). This may also have to do with the alarm brand.

As for the wait to start delay, any good alarm/remote start should have this built into the unit. If it does not, I would buy something that does. Why spend another $90 on something that could be built in?

The GEM module, if you happen to have one, should be a matter of wiring. If the installer is unable to figure this out, find someone competent to do the job.

The alarm/remote start I used is a Python 513; I bought it on sale from Sonicelectronix.com for $85, regular price is around $100. It's a good brand, made by DEI, they also make Viper, Clifford, Hornet, Avital, and a bunch of other brands. Does that answer your questions?


I've done a lot of remote starts over the years (the first one I did was around 1996) and my Ford was one of the easiest I've done. It's not that difficult for someone who knows what they are doing and probably only moderately difficult for someone who can figure out how to test and hook up some wiring.
The immobilizer bypass must have been what he was talking about. My truck doesn't have a chip key because my all metal spare starts the truck just fine.

As for the tech I couldn't imagine a 2003 needing one of those as long as the quality of the alarm is good. The wait to start is built in to the one that I was looking at, it has a diesel mode so it should be good to go for that.

The shop I talked to has nothing but good reviews and they seem to know what they are talking about but I think I need to go visit and talk in person to make sure.

I was looking at a viper kit, I think they 4103 and 5101 (I will have to double check those numbers). My cousin bought his 04 f250 with it pre installed and it was a very nice feature.

You did answer all of my questions and some lol. I could probably figure out how to do it myself but I don't really have the place or tools unless I go home to visit my parents (I'm away for school) and if I get this shop to do it, I believe they lifetime warranty their work. People rave about their service so I don't know.

Thanks for all of your insight, I'll go down and school them on some stuff and see what they say lol.

My RAZR made me send this...
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Old 11-09-2012, 06:39 AM
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my installer took forever to get my remote start going and spent hours on the phone with DEI and it took some modules as did my 2005 GM

mine uses a time delay the wait to start light apparently doesn't like to be tied into ?

also it seems if done incorrectly you can have automatic transmission damage if a signal isn't sent to the proper contact the trucks will be running but the transmission doesn't know that and can have a lubrication issue ( I have read this a few times but have no idea if it is true ?)

it's not a big deal 20 seconds is fine ,, I can also change it with a dei bitwriter anytime


you all have a GEM module by the way see this link http://blog.autopartscheaper.com/?p=38

the 12 volt.com is a good resource

Last edited by ZMANN; 11-09-2012 at 06:44 AM.
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Old 11-09-2012, 06:53 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ZMANN View Post
my installer took forever to get my remote start going and spent hours on the phone with DEI and it took some modules as did my 2005 GM

mine uses a time delay the wait to start light apparently doesn't like to be tied into ?

also it seems if done incorrectly you can have automatic transmission damage if a signal isn't sent to the proper contact the trucks will be running but the transmission doesn't know that and can have a lubrication issue ( I have read this a few times but have no idea if it is true ?)

it's not a big deal 20 seconds is fine ,, I can also change it with a dei bitwriter anytime


you all have a GEM module by the way see this link http://blog.autopartscheaper.com/?p=38

the 12 volt.com is a good resource
Do you remember what modules were needed?
My cousins truck waited 30 seconds then started but I feel that is to long so 20 seconds would be good.

The transmission thing make me worry a little bit. I will definitely have to ask this shop about that. I haven't heard this before but it is definitely a concern.

Thanks for that link, its sweet

My RAZR made me send this...
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Old 11-09-2012, 06:56 AM
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I don't remember what modules .. when I pulled this out of my GM I had about three

they can change the time I actually just bought the bitwriter off of ebay so I can do programming myself with out trying to listen to chirps and stuff using the manual method


I was a little nervous at first about the trany but mine has been fine for years ,, and may have just been a wives tale?
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Old 11-09-2012, 07:18 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ZMANN View Post
I don't remember what modules .. when I pulled this out of my GM I had about three

they can change the time I actually just bought the bitwriter off of ebay so I can do programming myself with out trying to listen to chirps and stuff using the manual method


I was a little nervous at first about the trany but mine has been fine for years ,, and may have just been a wives tale?
I've never heard of or read about this transmission thing either. Post a link if you have it please. If, and that's a really big if, this was a real problem, the only thing that may have an effect is not powering one of the ignition wires. But like I said, never heard or seen this as being an issue.

As for the GEM, if I had one, my alarm would probably be false alarming on me due to the pulse that's sent out by it. Or, different styles of GEM exist that may interact differently (probably more likely), which then makes the issue not do I have a GEM, but will it cause a problem?. Either way, I did nothing to address a GEM on my install and have not had any issues with the alarm at all, so it does not matter for my 2003. Your truck may be a little different than an 03, like everyone else, I'm sure Ford was adding some complexities as time went on.

I've read the same stuff about tying into the wait to start light, so I agree, probably best to play it safe using the timer. I set mine to 15 seconds using the chirps method, but bitwriter is definitely nice to have.

Last edited by 67rstbkt; 11-09-2012 at 07:24 AM.
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Old 11-09-2012, 07:50 AM
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Originally Posted by bwmtnbiker View Post
The immobilizer bypass must have been what he was talking about. My truck doesn't have a chip key because my all metal spare starts the truck just fine.

As for the tech I couldn't imagine a 2003 needing one of those as long as the quality of the alarm is good. The wait to start is built in to the one that I was looking at, it has a diesel mode so it should be good to go for that.

The shop I talked to has nothing but good reviews and they seem to know what they are talking about but I think I need to go visit and talk in person to make sure.

I was looking at a viper kit, I think they 4103 and 5101 (I will have to double check those numbers). My cousin bought his 04 f250 with it pre installed and it was a very nice feature.

You did answer all of my questions and some lol. I could probably figure out how to do it myself but I don't really have the place or tools unless I go home to visit my parents (I'm away for school) and if I get this shop to do it, I believe they lifetime warranty their work. People rave about their service so I don't know.

Thanks for all of your insight, I'll go down and school them on some stuff and see what they say lol.

My RAZR made me send this...
He was probably talking about the immobilizer, if I was still in the business I would have said the same thing. By 2003, most cars had some sort of system built in. I was really surprised that my truck did not have one. My little brother's 2003 Ranger has an immobilizer and a PITA GEM module that false alarmed every 45 minutes after I installed the alarm. Once I remembered about the GEM, a simple double diode isolate did the trick to stop the false alarms.

As long as it is a reputable shop that will 100% back up their work, you should be fine. Hopefully all of their installers are on the same page as far as quality. I've seen some really bad stuff over the years that people thought was "quality". I came from a big city and installed alarms almost every day, so my perspective was different from the people I worked with when I moved out west. Back home, alarms were our bread and butter, out here they were secondary to stereo systems. Any other questions, feel free to ask. This forum has been great in helping me out with my mechanical issues. I'm happy to be able to pass that along in any way that I can.
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