Time to Spend Some Money?? Random Hot Start Issue. - Ford Powerstroke Diesel Forum
Powerstroke.org is the premier Diesel Truck Forum on the internet. Registered Users do not see the above ads.
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 06-25-2012, 08:52 PM
Compression Ignition Addict
 

Join Date: Nov 2009
Posts: 380
Thanks: 28
Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Time to Spend Some Money?? Random Hot Start Issue.

Well I'm looking at spending some good hard earned money it seams lol.

Truck has developed a random hard start issue after it is warm. Just keeps cranking like crazy.

WARNING LONG DESCRIPTION

Here are the stats and history of the truck.

2005 Ford F250 CCSB 4x4 lariat.
Engine is all stock except for AFE intake that was on the truck when I bought it in 07 when it had only 19000 miles on it. Before I bought the truck I did a carfax and oasis report and both had nothing on them except a door rattle fix on the oasis. I have always changed the oil every 5 to 5500 miles and changed the fuel filters after every other oil change. Did the big service with a coolant flush at around 55k to 60k miles at Spradley Barr Ford in Fort Collins CO all fluids were changed and truck was gone though and everything was top notch.

In 09 noticed a little oil residue at the front of the engine so when I took it to Ford for the oil change I had them check it out they said nothing to worry about.

Since then no problems to speak of until last year @ 74000 miles or so. Early summer of 2011 I was in LA and truck would start just fine then as soon as you would try to go it would start missing and falling on its face at 2000 rpm. Had to let it idle for 10 minutes after reaching normal operating temperature and then there wasn’t a problem. I was able to get back to the bay area (Redwood city/San Francisco area) with no problems. Then put it on the scanner and found that FICM went bad. Got a remaned one from Swamps diesel and gave them my old one. After that it ran awesome, nice and strong.

Everything was fine, no issues till September 2011. Went to visit my mom in Truckee CA near Lake Tahoe and decided to take the boat too (4500lbs). So the day I left to head up with the boat it was 95 degrees outside at sea level. Everything was fine heading up the summit (went from sea level to 8800 feet) cruising right along 70mph not using AC just windows down while climbing the summit. Then near the summit we hit road work and had to slow down to a crawl then 5 minutes later I hear a pshhh sound but no steam from the hood. I get off and open up the hood and it puked but not very much at all. So I clean it up and let truck rest and then continued on up. I ran it hard to see if it would do it again and still never has. Coolant has been at the correct level always.

Once again no issues until February 2012. Drove down to LA everything was fine then on the way home after the weekend was hauling a$$ up the grape vine boost not going over 23 psi until close to the top where it reached about 27psi but then I heard a sound like it was missing or like steam blowing off in spurts. I pull over and pop the hood and nothing. No degas bottle puking, no fluid on the ground, no steam from anywhere. I was at a loss to what happened. Got on it again and everything is fine all the way home 455 miles. Mind you I have never seen any different colored smoke out of the tail pipe other than when the FICM failed.

Current no start while engine is warm issue first happened in March. Put it on the scanner no codes and at that time it was ready for an oil change and new fuel filters. So I went ahead and changed everything. Well started every time since until 2 weeks ago one night at the bank. Turned over like crazy but didn't catch. Waited 10 to 15 minutes fired right up. This issue seems to be very internment.

Now I am at a crossroads it is time for all the fluids except oil to be changed. Like coolant, diffs, transfer case, transmission etc...

I am trying to figure out how far I want to go with the fixes. And here in California I can't get rid of egr or change the exhaust much. When I had the inspection they checked everything under the hood and under the truck and plugged into the monitor and not really wanting to change parts back and forth every other year.

Current Readings:
Running at 70mph for 45 min on the flat.
EOT: 178 F
ECT: 184 F
FICM: 48 to 47.9
IAT: 123 F
IAT2: 154 F
INJ Press: 15
MAP psi: 14.9
EBP psi: 14.9

Parts I want/need to get:
1. Edge insight CTS with EGT probe
2. BPD oil cooler
3. Blue spring update.
4. BPD EGR cooler
5. New rear diff cover w/ cooling fins. What’s the best? I tow often.
6. Possibly ARP head studs with OEM gaskets but don't think mine went yet.
7. Coolant filter. Dono what's best?
8. Thinking of FICM tuning. Not sure if its worth it and what the long term effects are.
9. SCT scanner. What’s the best? Not looking for tons of power but some more and better MPGs would be nice.
10. Maybe exhaust, 4" but what is the best way to go when having to keep the Kitty??
11. If money allows me I want to get SCT or SCT x3 tunner

Things needed to be done.
1. Pull the egr and check/replace
2. Pull Turbo and probably clean it.
3. Perform a coolant flush and change over to ELC or whatever is best. Currently running Ford gold.
4. Check /replace HPOP screen
5. Check / replace ICP sensor
6. Don't know if the STC fitting was replaced but no indication that is was so assuming that it should be done.
7. Check/ replace Stand Pipes & Dummy Plugs. What’s a good brand or company to get these from?

Sorry for the long post but might as get it all in one. Let me know if I am missing anything and all input is welcome on where and what else to get or need to do. I plan on doing the work myself as I have access to a shop with a lift and plenty of tools as well as mechanics however they have never done anything like this on a 6.0L. Would love to go to left Coast diesel and talk and or watch them do this procedure. I have soured the forum and printed out a lot of how tos and manuals to fill my 4” binder but knowing more never hurts. Thanks in advance and I will update as things change.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
  #2  
Old 06-26-2012, 05:28 AM
Unapologetically American


 

Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Littleton, Colorado
Posts: 19,779
Thanks: 2
Thanked 9 Times in 8 Posts
Feedback Score: 4 reviews
Quote:
Originally Posted by MtHigh250 View Post
Well I'm looking at spending some good hard earned money it seams lol.

Truck has developed a random hard start issue after it is warm. Just keeps cranking like crazy.

WARNING LONG DESCRIPTION

Here are the stats and history of the truck.

2005 Ford F250 CCSB 4x4 lariat.
Engine is all stock except for AFE intake that was on the truck when I bought it in 07 when it had only 19000 miles on it. Before I bought the truck I did a carfax and oasis report and both had nothing on them except a door rattle fix on the oasis. I have always changed the oil every 5 to 5500 miles and changed the fuel filters after every other oil change. Did the big service with a coolant flush at around 55k to 60k miles at Spradley Barr Ford in Fort Collins CO all fluids were changed and truck was gone though and everything was top notch.

In 09 noticed a little oil residue at the front of the engine so when I took it to Ford for the oil change I had them check it out they said nothing to worry about.

Since then no problems to speak of until last year @ 74000 miles or so. Early summer of 2011 I was in LA and truck would start just fine then as soon as you would try to go it would start missing and falling on its face at 2000 rpm. Had to let it idle for 10 minutes after reaching normal operating temperature and then there wasn’t a problem. I was able to get back to the bay area (Redwood city/San Francisco area) with no problems. Then put it on the scanner and found that FICM went bad. Got a remaned one from Swamps diesel and gave them my old one. After that it ran awesome, nice and strong.

Everything was fine, no issues till September 2011. Went to visit my mom in Truckee CA near Lake Tahoe and decided to take the boat too (4500lbs). So the day I left to head up with the boat it was 95 degrees outside at sea level. Everything was fine heading up the summit (went from sea level to 8800 feet) cruising right along 70mph not using AC just windows down while climbing the summit. Then near the summit we hit road work and had to slow down to a crawl then 5 minutes later I hear a pshhh sound but no steam from the hood. I get off and open up the hood and it puked but not very much at all. So I clean it up and let truck rest and then continued on up. I ran it hard to see if it would do it again and still never has. Coolant has been at the correct level always.

Once again no issues until February 2012. Drove down to LA everything was fine then on the way home after the weekend was hauling a$$ up the grape vine boost not going over 23 psi until close to the top where it reached about 27psi but then I heard a sound like it was missing or like steam blowing off in spurts. I pull over and pop the hood and nothing. No degas bottle puking, no fluid on the ground, no steam from anywhere. I was at a loss to what happened. Got on it again and everything is fine all the way home 455 miles. Mind you I have never seen any different colored smoke out of the tail pipe other than when the FICM failed. Could have been bad fuel, but mine is smoking, and I sometimes have a hard time getting the boost over 3psi up a steep hill. Maybe your turbo vanes

Current no start while engine is warm issue first happened in March. Put it on the scanner no codes and at that time it was ready for an oil change and new fuel filters. So I went ahead and changed everything. Well started every time since until 2 weeks ago one night at the bank. Turned over like crazy but didn't catch. Waited 10 to 15 minutes fired right up. This issue seems to be very internment. Grab that scanner and monitor your ICP and IPR. Hot no starts usually come back to dummy plugs or STC fitting. Do both if you're doing one. The fact that you had old oil in there the last time you had issues makes me want to point the finger at those parts as well. My buddy had the same intermittent no start. He was at 6k on his oil change and had pulled a very heavy trailer numerous times. Changed the oil and all was well. He may have had more issues, but it's someone else's problem now

Now I am at a crossroads it is time for all the fluids except oil to be changed. Like coolant, diffs, transfer case, transmission etc...

I am trying to figure out how far I want to go with the fixes. And here in California I can't get rid of egr or change the exhaust much. When I had the inspection they checked everything under the hood and under the truck and plugged into the monitor and not really wanting to change parts back and forth every other year.

Current Readings:
Running at 70mph for 45 min on the flat. What was the ambient air temp? Looks like it was well over 100*F
EOT: 178 F
ECT: 184 F
FICM: 48 to 47.9
IAT: 123 F
IAT2: 154 F
INJ Press: 15
MAP psi: 14.9
EBP psi: 14.9

The EOT and ECT seem very low for that IAT and driving for 45 minutes. Maybe you need a thermostat???

Parts I want/need to get:
1. Edge insight CTS with EGT probe Great choice
2. BPD oil cooler NICE
3. Blue spring update. Debatable, but I installed one anyway
4. BPD EGR cooler NICE
5. New rear diff cover w/ cooling fins. What’s the best? I tow often. The newer diff covers from the the 6.4 (08-10) will fit perfect
6. Possibly ARP head studs with OEM gaskets but don't think mine went yet.I would leave it unless you have money burning a hole
7. Coolant filter. Dono what's best? Any of them are going to get the job done. Mine is made by Dfuser. Jeffrey has the Sinister
8. Thinking of FICM tuning. Not sure if its worth it and what the long term effects are. Mine is tuned from PHP,a nd it does seem to have better throttle response, and a little more power. I can't say that I gained any milage though
9. SCT scanner. What’s the best? Not looking for tons of power but some more and better MPGs would be nice. If you're looking at it for mileage, I wouldn't waste your money. I never gained any, and I'm far from being the only one. Get it for the power
10. Maybe exhaust, 4" but what is the best way to go when having to keep the Kitty?? You could look into a high flow performance cat in 4". Gregg bought one from Jegs or something for his 7.3
11. If money allows me I want to get SCT or SCT x3 tunner

Are 9 and 10 the same question?

Things needed to be done.
1. Pull the egr and check/replace
2. Pull Turbo and probably clean it.
3. Perform a coolant flush and change over to ELC or whatever is best. Currently running Ford gold. If you plan to replace the OE oil cooler with a BPD one, I'd just leave the Gold in there. After you change the cooler, there's nothing to clog
4. Check /replace HPOP screen
5. Check / replace ICP sensor
6. Don't know if the STC fitting was replaced but no indication that is was so assuming that it should be done.
7. Check/ replace Stand Pipes & Dummy Plugs. What’s a good brand or company to get these from? Tousley

Sorry for the long post but might as get it all in one. Let me know if I am missing anything and all input is welcome on where and what else to get or need to do. I plan on doing the work myself as I have access to a shop with a lift and plenty of tools as well as mechanics however they have never done anything like this on a 6.0L. Would love to go to left Coast diesel and talk and or watch them do this procedure. I have soured the forum and printed out a lot of how tos and manuals to fill my 4” binder but knowing more never hurts. Thanks in advance and I will update as things change.
Holy hell Cameron, you windbag!

My replies in red

Last edited by 2006PSDSD; 06-26-2012 at 05:33 AM.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #3  
Old 06-26-2012, 07:42 AM
Compression Ignition Addict
 

Join Date: Nov 2009
Posts: 380
Thanks: 28
Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Thanks Nick. Yeah I know it was a lot to say and type up lol guess I had to make you work for it. Yeah 9 & 11 were the same question lol My no start issue is very random and every once in a while. Although rarely I will get a puff of smoke some times blue and some times mix of blue and black on a very cold start but I just think that is just normal with 6.0L. I love the trucks power as it is but might be ready for some more so that's why I am questioning these items now. I love hauling a$$ up the hills passing everyone else struggling to make it up and the truck still up shifts . I just would rather do everything right the fist time then to go back and do it again.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #4  
Old 06-26-2012, 10:14 AM
Unapologetically American


 

Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Littleton, Colorado
Posts: 19,779
Thanks: 2
Thanked 9 Times in 8 Posts
Feedback Score: 4 reviews
It could be some issue with the ICP sensor for the random no starts . The fact that it cools down for 10 minutes and then restarts, leads me to believe it's a HPO leak somewhere

I hate driving my truck without the tuner, if that says anything to you
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #5  
Old 07-06-2012, 04:39 AM
Compression Ignition Addict
 

Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Denver
Posts: 345
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
IPR valve possible. Mine did same. if u can scan with a MODIS or other good scanner check the injector control pressure. if its under 500psi the truck will not fire. there is also a way to check pressure by measuring voltage or ohms at the ICP sensor but i dont remember the steps... IPR is under the turbo on the 6.0 Definately reasearch the IPR n see if the symptoms match. when mine went out it did the crank no start thing then after sitting started back up... randomly happened bout 3 times over couple weeks with the 4th time leaving me stranded.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #6  
Old 07-11-2012, 07:03 PM
Compression Ignition Addict
 

Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Denver
Posts: 345
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
did you ever track down the problem?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #7  
Old 08-31-2012, 08:26 PM
Compression Ignition Addict
 

Join Date: Nov 2009
Posts: 380
Thanks: 28
Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Quote:
Originally Posted by bigwheelsbigtires View Post
did you ever track down the problem?
Well I tested it and nothing seemed to be wrong and I haven't had the issue since. New news though I've had my CTS insight for a month now and everything was fine im the bay area until this weekend when I drove up to Tahoe on a 88 degree evening now I got a miss or hesitation at the bottom of a grade as I begin to accelerate. Then I got it a few more times. It makes a sound like turbo blow off or something. My stats comming up the summit were eot would range from 188 to 220. The ect would range from 178 to 213. But the delta between them never went over 11. I was driving at 68-80mph. Ficm voltage stayed at 48 and the ficm isn't even a year old. I have noticed that in the morning my battery voltage is in the 11.0 to 11.7 range while cranking and then takes about 30s to a minute to get to 13.2v but that also fluctuates to 12.2v all the time. I think one of my batteries is on the way out? Idk. When I got to my Mom's I checked to see if any codes came up and sure enough the P0404 code was there. I guess its time to deal with the EGR. Clean it or new one? So now I think I have a combination of problems. Well tell me what you bite think. Thanks in advance.

Sent from my SCH-I500 using AutoGuide.Com Free App
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #8  
Old 09-02-2012, 06:39 AM
Unapologetically American


 

Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Littleton, Colorado
Posts: 19,779
Thanks: 2
Thanked 9 Times in 8 Posts
Feedback Score: 4 reviews
Clean and disconnect the EGR valve. That may be the hesitation you're feeling. I don't know if you're running tunes or not, to have the EGR valve turned off electronically. Batteries are fine, that 30 delay is normal
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #9  
Old 09-02-2012, 07:59 AM
Compression Ignition Addict
 

Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: port arthur texas
Posts: 3,502
Thanks: 0
Thanked 20 Times in 19 Posts
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Your low coolant temps still puzzel me. A 6.0 should never have less than 195 deg+- 3.
Unless you are running the wrong thermostat the stock 6.0 thermostat opens at 195.
To be haveing that low of coolant temps it must be stuck open. Guess you didn't change it fom the last time.

I sometimes wonder what the pcm is supposed to do when it sees below normal threshold levels. It is bound to mess with it's calculations. Maybe it is not meant for us mere mortals to know. LOL
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #10  
Old 09-03-2012, 10:02 PM
Compression Ignition Addict
 

Join Date: Nov 2009
Posts: 380
Thanks: 28
Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Quote:
Originally Posted by 2006PSDSD View Post
Clean and disconnect the EGR valve. That may be the hesitation you're feeling. I don't know if you're running tunes or not, to have the EGR valve turned off electronically. Batteries are fine, that 30 delay is normal
Well I'm not running any tunes yet. I won't until I get the truck running right. I need the money for fixes first then fun . Also being in Cal always makes modding very tricky. I have to smog the rig in few months anyway. About the batteries that's good to know that they are ok. I have noticed that some of my hard starts are when the truck is facing down hill

Sent from my SCH-I500 using AutoGuide.Com Free App
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now

In order to be able to post messages on the Ford Powerstroke Diesel Forum forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.
User Name:
If you do not want to register, fill this field only and the name will be used as user name for your post.
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.
Password:
Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.
Email Address:

Log-in

Human Verification

In order to verify that you are a human and not a spam bot, please enter the answer into the following box below based on the instructions contained in the graphic.



Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On



All times are GMT -8. The time now is 01:48 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.6.1
Garage Plus, Vendor Tools vBulletin Plugins by Drive Thru Online, Inc.

vB.Sponsors