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Old 12-11-2011, 03:06 PM
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Need help! 6.0 coolant

ok i am new on here but have done a lot of reading. I just bought a 2005. 6.0 pstroke ext cab lbox FX4 a few months back. It has been cold here the last few days, and i have noticed that when I start it and let it warm up for around 10 mins or so and then drive it, it will not blow a whitish water vapor but once I really get on it it will just blow a little and then go away, and never do it again. I will shut it off and go do something get back in it 25 mins later and it will do the same thing then clear up. These were at outdoor temps of around 9-15 degrees. Then the other night it was 9 out and it just had vapor all the time. I am pretty sure its like water vapor and not smoke. But today i drove it and its 44 degrees outside and didn't have any signs of vapor or anything. I changed my primary and secondary fuel filters, pulled egr valve and cleaned it, i did notice it was slightly oily looking in the intake manifold. I am not loosing any noticable amount of coolant and i watch it like a hawk. Today I performed the "Hero' kit style test on the degass bottle and it stayed pretty constant at 10 psi or so even after really getting on it. I got on it in 3rd gear and let it wind up and I got it to hit 15 psi and releave pressure once, and then once again on the interstate with my foot in the floor. put in order to get it to releave pressure i had to be boosting around 20 PSI or so. So sorry for all the babaling, but does it sound like i have an egr cooler fail or a head gasket problem. or am I just paranoid. The truck is bone stock and there is no coolant stains on the reservoir, and the egr looks as if it may have been changed before. It just looks really clean and the blue connection hose looks pretty new. Any help is appreciated. Thanks
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Old 12-11-2011, 03:14 PM
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Yes, your EGR cooler is shot and your EGR valve is getting steam cleaned. Now you need to check the temp delta between the oil and coolant to see if you need a new oil cooler as well. Then a cooling system flush new cooler and an EGR delete. make sure you clean the turbo also. All that water going past the turbo is rusting it inside. You adventure has just started. Do a lot of reading and searching then ask all the questions you need answered and we will hook you up. Read the t-shooting guide in my signature for more good info. This IS the time to update the STC fitting on the HPOP.

No longer a 6.0 virgin. New STC, Cleaned turbo, welded EGR cooler closed. PIC's

Q: Do I have a blown EGR cooler?

A: Remove the EGR valve and look down the hole, some times the truck will have to be parked nose down over night. If you see any wetness, wet gooey soot, or it looks steam cleaned, your EGR cooler is bad. This is a good time to do a delete if you can, if you can't I would recommend a new cooler from bullet proof diesel.


Q: Do I have a blown head gasket?

A: Generally if there is a slow gradual pressure increases in the cooling system over 16 PSI then this points to an EGR cooler / oil cooler failure. If the pressure in the cooling system tries to head to and exceed 20psi pretty fast in a cool motor then this points to a head gasket failure. Put a Tee in one of the rubber lines going to the de-gas tank and attach the line for your gauge to that. Or buy new hose and make a test rig to use for now and then loan to all your buds later on. This is as simple as a 3/8 hose barb Tee,5 clamps, 30 PSI gauge and some 3/8 air line. Cut 2 short stubs out of the air line to span the gap between the manifold and the de-gas tank. Next since you saved the end of the air line that has a 1/4 FNPT fitting crimped to it, the free end goes to the tee and your gauge attaches to the factory crimped on FNPT fitting. You will use a gauge with a 30 full scale reading. The cap on the De-gas tank is a 16 lb relief, this is why 16 psi is the magic number. The pressure you reach is not as important as the rate of climb. The reason for the slow increase in pressure for the EGR cooler/ oil cooler failure is as follows. The oil cooler plugs up and starves the EGR cooler for coolant thus turning it into a superheated steam generator. This point source of heat and excess pressure will lead to the EGR cooler failure. In this condition some have reported the melting nipple on the de-gas tank the attaches to a rubber hose that vents steam from the EGR cooler.

The rapid rise in pressure associated with a head gasket failure is caused by combustion gasses entering the cooling system and raising the cooling system pressure until the vent on the de-gas tank cap opens and the puking starts. I think NAPA has a test strip you can use to detect combustion gasses in the coolant.

OK so with a quick check of a saturated steam chart this is what we know.

15.3 PSIg steam equals 250 degF

20 PSIg steam equals 259 degF

What this mean is that if you take a cold truck out and run the heck out of it and it builds pressure to 20PSI or more and the coolant isn’t 260 deg then it’s a safe bet that combustion gasses are entering the cooling system because you have a bad head gasket.

Water boils at 212 deg at zero PSIg. In a closed system there is a very predictable relationship between steam pressure and steam temperature. This is why cooling systems are pressurised. This way you can have 248 deg coolant that is at about 15 PSIa and you make no steam because the coolant isn’t it’s boiling temp for that pressure, it is however saturated. Now at addition of ethylene glycol raised the boiling point too but for what we are taking about we can use a table for water-based steam. If the system doesn’t get hot enough to the point it should make steam and its building pressure you know that pressure is from a different source like combustion gasses entering the cooling system. From ---- wait for it ------ BAD HEAD GASKETS.






Q: What is the delta between EOT and ECT?

A: Delta refers to the difference between the oil and coolant temperatures. This delta should not exceed 15 deg F , if it does once the truck it up to operating temperature going straight down the highway your oil cooler is plugged up.

Q: What is a high pressure oil system leak.

A: On a 6.0 the fuel injectors are powered by high pressure oil in the range of 550 to 3500 psi. This oil is supplied by a high-pressure oil pump that is driven off the cam gear in the rear of the engine. The oil is transported via a network of connectors , tubes and passages that have o-rings , seals and connectors that over time will develop leaks. The main suspects are the stand pipes and dummy plugs under the valve covers inside the “ oil log” The next problem area on 05-07 trucks is what is know as an STC or Snap To Connect fitting. This fitting Blows apart randomly and your truck will be dead were it stops. This fitting is located on the output side of the HPOP and an updated solid part is available from Ford or International. High Pressure oil leaks can also occur at the injector o-rings or from cracked branch tubes but this is rare. The way to test for a high pressure oil leak is by injecting air into the ICP sensor port and listing for the leak. Some leakage at the HPOP shaft seal is normal. Normaly high pressure oil leaks will be characterized by high IPR values and below normal ICP values as well as hot start and rough hot idle problems.

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Old 12-11-2011, 03:27 PM
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well thats better news than a blown head gasket. my next question is. does anyone have a good step by step or how to with some pics of how to remove the egr cooler. I am pretty mechanically inclined but i always feel better if i have something to look at before i go tackeling something like this.
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Old 12-11-2011, 03:31 PM
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Check out the link I posted twice now that shows and tells how I did it. Taking care of The EGR cooler is only treating the symptom. You also have to find out if your oil cooler is shot. Running with a plugged oil cooler is not good to say the least. At worst oil cooler can burst mixing the oil and coolant ( very bad mojo ) Use the search box, there is a lot of good info on the topic on here.


No longer a 6.0 virgin. New STC, Cleaned turbo, welded EGR cooler closed. PIC's

You can also search for a Sinister diesel EGR delete kit or others then download the directions. NO the intake manifold does NOT need to come out to do only the egr cooler.

Last edited by HAM_RADIO_MAN; 12-11-2011 at 03:37 PM.
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Old 12-11-2011, 03:38 PM
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ok thanks, i didn't see that before, thank you for the help if anyone else has any tips or advice from experience id love to here it.
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Old 12-11-2011, 04:04 PM
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Make damn sure you clean that turbo.

Mine blew 2K miles after dealer did my egr cooler. They didn't clean the turbo. By then my warranty was up.

I also pulled my radiator and air cooler and had them douched out at the local radiator works while I was in there. It's cheap and quick once you're in there.
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Old 12-11-2011, 05:38 PM
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You can find more info on this link, be sure to look at the PDF files.
Oil cooler and EGR cooler service PDF files and notes
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Old 12-11-2011, 06:00 PM
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if i delete the EGR Dont I have to put some type of a tuner on my truck then, as mine is a 2005. I want one that i can have set to stock all the time and then just push a button and go to the higher hp setting if I want. what one does that? Being as my truck doesnt have ARP studs, that i know of
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Old 12-11-2011, 07:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dbruene View Post
if i delete the EGR Dont I have to put some type of a tuner on my truck then, as mine is a 2005. I want one that i can have set to stock all the time and then just push a button and go to the higher hp setting if I want. what one does that? Being as my truck doesnt have ARP studs, that i know of
Depending on the PCM strategy (truck computer), some '05's have the CEL come on when you delete the EGR cooler.

Stay away from "push a button for more HP" of "shift on the fly" tuning. These type of tuners don't recalibrate the TCM (trans computer) enough to handle the extra power the motor is putting out and can cause damage to the trans.
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Old 12-11-2011, 07:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lilpooh View Post
Depending on the PCM strategy (truck computer), some '05's have the CEL come on when you delete the EGR cooler.

Stay away from "push a button for more HP" of "shift on the fly" tuning. These type of tuners don't recalibrate the TCM (trans computer) enough to handle the extra power the motor is putting out and can cause damage to the trans.

Especially Banks 6 gun. Those things NUKE Ficms and PCMs I had a drawer full of them in my tool box any of those style "chips" that have a jumper cable from the PCM to the chip to the ficm, i will not endorse or recommend.

You are better off getting an SCT with custom tunes
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