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Old 07-24-2011, 05:26 PM
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EGR delete Question

I am about to do a oil cooler replacement, due to my EGR cooler leaking, and I am trying to decide whether to do a delete or go with the Bulletproof cooler. Have seen that some people have installed blanks or blinds in the inlet exhaust and outlet exhaust of the cooler.

My question is how to produce the blanks and how thick do they have to be? I realize that I would have to put gaskets on each side of the blanks.

Any comments about doing a delete this way?

Thanks

2005 F-250 Lariat Crew Cab- Stock
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Old 07-24-2011, 05:49 PM
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If you are going to delete the EGR cooler, it would be easier to install an EGR cooler delete kit (about 200 bucks).
If you have a visual check of your egr system, then go with the bulletproof egr delete that looks just like an egr cooler.
Keep in mind that the bulletproof egr delete will utilize the existing up-pipe on the passenger side. Since you have an 05, that up-pipe has a very restrictive scoop installed internally to direct exhaust flow through the egr cooler. This scoop should be removed. The up-pipe has to come off the truck and you would use something like a dremel to cut the scoop out.

If you go with the egr cooler delete kit, a new up-pipe comes with the kit that deletes the entire section that feeds exhaust gas to the egr cooler.

I am not a fan of using "block off plates" since it leaves the stock egr cooler in place that is prone to failure. If the welds fail, you could still have a failure and coolant would still leak into the intake, possibly resulting in head gasket failure.
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Old 07-24-2011, 06:35 PM
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Yup what Sergeant Schultz said.
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Old 07-25-2011, 05:41 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NYC F-350 View Post
If you are going to delete the EGR cooler, it would be easier to install an EGR cooler delete kit (about 200 bucks).
If you have a visual check of your egr system, then go with the bulletproof egr delete that looks just like an egr cooler.
Keep in mind that the bulletproof egr delete will utilize the existing up-pipe on the passenger side. Since you have an 05, that up-pipe has a very restrictive scoop installed internally to direct exhaust flow through the egr cooler. This scoop should be removed. The up-pipe has to come off the truck and you would use something like a dremel to cut the scoop out.

If you go with the egr cooler delete kit, a new up-pipe comes with the kit that deletes the entire section that feeds exhaust gas to the egr cooler.

I am not a fan of using "block off plates" since it leaves the stock egr cooler in place that is prone to failure. If the welds fail, you could still have a failure and coolant would still leak into the intake, possibly resulting in head gasket failure.
Ok, if I go with an "EGR Cooler" delete kit, what effect does the hot exhaust have on the still controlling EGR valve? With the "block off plates" the EGR valve still operates but no exhaust gas is being introduced to the intake.

Explain how a weld failing will get coolant into the intake, I am kinda lost on that one. It looks to me that if a weld failed then the worst thing would be an external coolant leak.

NYC F-350, thanks for all your input, knowledge and willingness to share.

tideman
Mobile, Alabama
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Old 07-25-2011, 06:20 AM
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Ok, what I was seeing and confusing was the up pipe that everyone shows on their delete kit, I was thinking that was put in place of the cooler itself. Think I got it now....:^)
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Old 07-25-2011, 06:26 AM
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What do you guys think of this delete kit?

EGR Delete Kit | Ford 6.0 Liter EGR Delete

Thanks,
tideman
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Old 07-25-2011, 06:48 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tideman View Post
Ok, if I go with an "EGR Cooler" delete kit, what effect does the hot exhaust have on the still controlling EGR valve? With the "block off plates" the EGR valve still operates but no exhaust gas is being introduced to the intake.
Lets look at the options available.
Delete kits:
Below you will see a pic of the up-pipe that comes with a delete kit versus the stock up-pipe. The stock up-pipe is the lower of the two in the pic. Note the flange that your existing EGR cooler connects to to allow the exhaust gases to flow through the stock egr cooler, and the absence of such a flange on the delete up-pipe. Since a delete kit does not attach to the exhaust, there will not be any exhaust gases being fed into the intake and the egr valve. The valve can be left in place in the intake, since there will not be any exhaust flow for it to regulate. The EGR valve should be left in the intake (IMHO) because there is some evidence that unplugging the valve can result in issues with your cooling fan.



The pic above is only if you go with the delete kits, and NOT the one from bulletproof diesel. The egr cooler delete through bulletproof diesel would still utilize the stock, existing up-pipe. The bulletprooof diesel egr cooler delete appears to be an egr cooler but is solid and does not have passages in it to allow the exhaust gases to flow through it. It is recommended that, should you have an 05-up engine, you should still remove the existing up-pipe and use a tool like a dremel to remove the "egr cooler scoop" that is internal to the up-pipe and was put there to direct as much of the exhaust gases as possible through your egr cooler.

A pic of a popular delete kit:



The "U" shaped pipe is installed to redirect the coolant flow from the top of the oil cooler back into the bottom of the intake manifold.

A pic of the bulletproof diesel egr cooler delete: (This type is called a "sneaky delete" since it will appear stock for a visual inspection)



Look internally to the cooler in the pic. It is solid inside and that is what will block the exhaust flow. Unlike the kits that totally remove the egr cooler from the engine.
Coolant enters this type of delete the same as the stock unit (through the long pipe attached), but since it is solid inside and blocks the exhaust flow, it can not leak into the intake.

Quote:
Originally Posted by tideman View Post
Explain how a weld failing will get coolant into the intake, I am kinda lost on that one. It looks to me that if a weld failed then the worst thing would be an external coolant leak.
The reason behind everyone deleting the EGR cooler is to stop the egr cooler failure from resulting in head gasket failure.
There are two ways in which this could occur. The first is that the failed egr cooler will leak coolant. When the PCM commands the egr valve to open, this coolant is sucked into the intake manifold and the coolant is then sucked into the combustion cylinders. The coolant will boil and create steam and steam pressure. This pressure will create much higher cylinder pressure than the stock TTY (torque to yield) head studs can handle and they stretch. That causes the head gaskets to blow.
The second way a failed EGR cooler can harm your engine is when the coolant flows the opposite direction. When you shut the truck off, the pressure in the cooling system can be sufficient enough to force the coolant out of the failed EGR cooler. The coolant will flow down the up-pipe that the EGR cooler connects to, and enter the exhaust manifold on the passenger side. If the exhaust valves just happen to be open, coolant can fill the cylinder. This will cause hydrolocking of the engine.

If you were to weld plugs/plates/whatever over the exhaust openings of the existing egr cooler, and your weld fails, it would act much like a failed egr cooler and could result in what was just outlined above. If you choose this method, make sure that whoever welds the egr cooler knows what they are doing. Also, it is STILL recommended that you remove the up-ipe on the passenger side and use the dremel to remove the egr scoop, then reinstall the up-pipe.

PREPOSTING EDIT: You might get it now, but heck, I already typed this all out, so I am posting it anyway.
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Old 07-25-2011, 06:52 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tideman View Post
That just so happens to be the egr delete kit I used on my truck. The fit of the up-pipe has to be just right for it to work. It will take patience to get it all lined up.
If you are going to install this yourself, check out the "Step by step" link in my signature line and read the notes about getting the y-pipe lined up, post repair.
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Old 07-25-2011, 10:37 AM
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NYC F-350 Thanks

Quote:
Originally Posted by NYC F-350 View Post
Lets look at the options available.
Delete kits:
Below you will see a pic of the up-pipe that comes with a delete kit versus the stock up-pipe. The stock up-pipe is the lower of the two in the pic. Note the flange that your existing EGR cooler connects to to allow the exhaust gases to flow through the stock egr cooler, and the absence of such a flange on the delete up-pipe. Since a delete kit does not attach to the exhaust, there will not be any exhaust gases being fed into the intake and the egr valve. The valve can be left in place in the intake, since there will not be any exhaust flow for it to regulate. The EGR valve should be left in the intake (IMHO) because there is some evidence that unplugging the valve can result in issues with your cooling fan.



The pic above is only if you go with the delete kits, and NOT the one from bulletproof diesel. The egr cooler delete through bulletproof diesel would still utilize the stock, existing up-pipe. The bulletprooof diesel egr cooler delete appears to be an egr cooler but is solid and does not have passages in it to allow the exhaust gases to flow through it. It is recommended that, should you have an 05-up engine, you should still remove the existing up-pipe and use a tool like a dremel to remove the "egr cooler scoop" that is internal to the up-pipe and was put there to direct as much of the exhaust gases as possible through your egr cooler.

A pic of a popular delete kit:



The "U" shaped pipe is installed to redirect the coolant flow from the top of the oil cooler back into the bottom of the intake manifold.

A pic of the bulletproof diesel egr cooler delete: (This type is called a "sneaky delete" since it will appear stock for a visual inspection)



Look internally to the cooler in the pic. It is solid inside and that is what will block the exhaust flow. Unlike the kits that totally remove the egr cooler from the engine.
Coolant enters this type of delete the same as the stock unit (through the long pipe attached), but since it is solid inside and blocks the exhaust flow, it can not leak into the intake.



The reason behind everyone deleting the EGR cooler is to stop the egr cooler failure from resulting in head gasket failure.
There are two ways in which this could occur. The first is that the failed egr cooler will leak coolant. When the PCM commands the egr valve to open, this coolant is sucked into the intake manifold and the coolant is then sucked into the combustion cylinders. The coolant will boil and create steam and steam pressure. This pressure will create much higher cylinder pressure than the stock TTY (torque to yield) head studs can handle and they stretch. That causes the head gaskets to blow.
The second way a failed EGR cooler can harm your engine is when the coolant flows the opposite direction. When you shut the truck off, the pressure in the cooling system can be sufficient enough to force the coolant out of the failed EGR cooler. The coolant will flow down the up-pipe that the EGR cooler connects to, and enter the exhaust manifold on the passenger side. If the exhaust valves just happen to be open, coolant can fill the cylinder. This will cause hydrolocking of the engine.

If you were to weld plugs/plates/whatever over the exhaust openings of the existing egr cooler, and your weld fails, it would act much like a failed egr cooler and could result in what was just outlined above. If you choose this method, make sure that whoever welds the egr cooler knows what they are doing. Also, it is STILL recommended that you remove the up-ipe on the passenger side and use the dremel to remove the egr scoop, then reinstall the up-pipe.

PREPOSTING EDIT: You might get it now, but heck, I already typed this all out, so I am posting it anyway.
Sir,
Your are a gentleman and a 6.0 Powerstroke scholar! Thanks a ton for your patients and information. I just ordered the delete kit @ delete kit.com and a coolant filter from Sinister.

I also have printed all your step by step instructions that you have posted here and at Dieselstop.com, I am assuming you are one and the same Ex mounty.

Again, thanks for the info.

tideman
Mobile, Alabama
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Old 07-25-2011, 10:44 AM
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The reason I went for the delete kit versus the welded ends of the orginal egr cooler was what you called a scoop and what I would call a diverter in the up pipe.

I would not be worried about the weld failing because the folks were I work do that for a living and their welds are probably better than the stock pieces on the cooler. Having said that, the diverter would creat a restriction, as you noted in an earlier post. The though of cutting that out while doing all the other stuff, oil cooler, turbo cleaning and putting it all back together was just a little too much sugar. So I went for a straight open up pipe.

Again,
Thanks
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