Ford Powerstroke Diesel Forum banner

Bulletproofed and won't run

7K views 30 replies 8 participants last post by  fordsvtparts 
#1 ·
I decided to open a name on this forum as I have lurked here forever and now have an issue with my truck that may require more detail. I have an early build date 2004 6.0 Powerstroke and have recently done a lot of work to it.

The trucks been a plow truck it's whole life and the oil pan recently rusted through to the point where it was leaking and chipping large chunks of rotted metal. All the oil pan bolts were rusted so it was time to pull the motor and get it upside down on a stand to extract the bolts. When I was in there I pulled the heads and studded it (first timer for powerstroke, not first time doing head gaskets though).

Here's where the problem comes in. I have the truck back together and am not getting enough icp pressure. My first check was the ipr screen. I had a buddy with a low mile IPR valve sitting in his garage and I tried that one. Original ICP was 270 psi. New(er) IPR valve and new(er) screen got me up to 330 psi. I figured I would try a brand new oem IPR valve w/ screen and ended up back at 270 psi.

I've seen threads where early model HPOP's were dropping this ball valve on the side of the pump and I'm curious if that could have happened to me when I turned my engine on my stand?

I think I've ruled out IPR valve / clogged ipr screen as a problem.

What is my next step from here?
Can I do an hpop leak test with shop air even though my ICP sensor is on the rear of the motor?
Is it possible that ball valve dropped when I turned my engine upside down?

For the sake of adding as much information as possible I did not remove the hpop at all during the work I preformed. The HPOP did leak a lot of oil on the stand and I got my IPR and ICP soaked in oil. My ICP sensor is still reading pressure so I believe it to still be good.
 

Attachments

See less See more
4
#2 ·
Are you sure that it is building low pressure? No low, no high.
 
#4 ·
I understand about your HPOP pressure (ICP). I'm asking if your low pressure pump is building pressure. The quick/unreliable way to check is to see if the dash gauge is coming up. The downside is that will only tell you that you are building over 7psi.

There is a regulator at the front of the engine that sometimes gets stuck - or left out during rebuilds. There are a number of things that it could be. This just seemed a good thing to rule out before going to the more complex stuff.

 
#6 ·
I understand about your HPOP pressure (ICP). I'm asking if your low pressure pump is building pressure. The quick/unreliable way to check is to see if the dash gauge is coming up. The downside is that will only tell you that you are building over 7psi.

There is a regulator at the front of the engine that sometimes gets stuck - or left out during rebuilds. There are a number of things that it could be. This just seemed a good thing to rule out before going to the more complex stuff.
I find it interesting you mentioned this. The oil pressure gauge on my truck does move, however it takes a long time of cranking for it to move. I may crank on the truck for 20 seconds at a time and it may take 5-10 seconds for my gauge on the truck to move at all. After the inital 5-10 seconds of cranking the gauge will shoot right up in the middle where it should be.

Does my truck have low pressure? Yes. However it takes a little bit for it to come up. Not sure what this means?

Note: I did not mess with the pick up tube or screen when I changed the pan on the stand. I put the new pan on quickly as to avoid any contamination.
 
#5 ·
I think the first question should be.....how long have you tried cranking? Did you fill the hpop resivor or oil rails ?
 
#7 ·
I've tried cranking on the truck for the an hour or so each day for the last 3 days with jumper boxes or jumper cables hooked up to it. Up to 20 second cranks at a time with pressure never going over 270 or 330 depending on which IPR I was using.

I did purge air out of the fuel filter and then cycled the key 6+ times to get as much air out as possible. I also recently checked the fuel filter to see if any oil has contaminated my fuel and it is clean diesel in there. I believe this is a way to tell if your injectors are sealed correctly.
 
#13 ·
A buddy has the icp test tube. That should work for an early build (ICP behind ipr) 6.0 correct? Just harder to get to?

If the air pressure test doesn't reveal anything, the next step could be to check low pressure oil in the low pressure oil test port on the oil cooler. Although 7 psi does trip the gauge on, but might not be enough to fill the HPOP to what it needs to maintain a high pressure. Starting pressure from a cold start ought to be above 25 PSI. There was a post recently that ended up being a loose pick up tube.

Certainly looks like you took your time and cleaned it well.
I tried, I hope to never have to take the heads off again.

I'm pretty sure almost zero low pressure can still fill the hpop resivor, so I'd say if the gauge is moving the hpop is being fed.....the low pressure system is still very important though and needs to be healthy.
I think its strange how my gauge in the truck wont move at all for the first 5-10 seconds of cranking. That was not the case before I pulled the engine.

Op reading some of your post I'm not sure if you completely understand what is being said....the engine has two oil pumps one high psi one low psi, the low psi pump supplies oil to the normal stuff like bearings, it also supplies oil to the high psi pump, the high psi pumps only job is to force the injectors open.
Again my assumption could be wrong, it's just kinda how it reads to me.
This clears up a lot for me. I did not know I had a high and low pressure oil pump. Everything I've read is only about the high pressure pump. Thank you for clarifying

Also try unplugging the icp (it's pretty easy to reach from under the truck) and see if it starts with it unplugged.
I tried that. Instead of ecm reading a default of 500 psi my truck just read nothing. I believe it's a late build or second generation six liter trick
 
#9 ·
If the air pressure test doesn't reveal anything, the next step could be to check low pressure oil in the low pressure oil test port on the oil cooler. Although 7 psi does trip the gauge on, but might not be enough to fill the HPOP to what it needs to maintain a high pressure. Starting pressure from a cold start ought to be above 25 PSI. There was a post recently that ended up being a loose pick up tube.

Certainly looks like you took your time and cleaned it well.
 
#10 ·
I'm pretty sure almost zero low pressure can still fill the hpop resivor, so I'd say if the gauge is moving the hpop is being fed.....the low pressure system is still very important though and needs to be healthy.
 
#11 ·
Op reading some of your post I'm not sure if you completely understand what is being said....the engine has two oil pumps one high psi one low psi, the low psi pump supplies oil to the normal stuff like bearings, it also supplies oil to the high psi pump, the high psi pumps only job is to force the injectors open.
Again my assumption could be wrong, it's just kinda how it reads to me.
 
#12 ·
Also try unplugging the icp (it's pretty easy to reach from under the truck) and see if it starts with it unplugged.
 
#14 ·
Work has been keeping me away from this truck. Today I finally had a chance to get to it.

Pulled the driver side valve cover, hooked up the ficm and had a friend crank the key while I checked for any visual oil leaks. I didn't see any oil coming anywhere and I'm concerened as I didn't see any oil being shot onto the top end. Should I see oil being pumped up to the rockers/ top end while I'm cranking the engine?
 
#18 ·
So...
  • An air test indicates no leaks.
  • Disconnecting the ICP doesn't generate a start but produces the proper 500psi reading.
  • Swapping the ICP changes the reading from low to low.
  • The IPR screen is clean.

I would...
  • Put a cheapo oil pressure gauge on the LPOP system and verify pressure.
  • Verify the IPR valve wiring and connector integrity on both ends.
  • Check the IPR screen one more time.

...and - if that led to nothing - I'd be shopping for an HPOP.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Heavy_GD
#19 ·
What DJMaguire says seems sound.

Correct me if I'm wrong but the early build 04 has the 03 type oil pump.

Whereas the newer oil pumps don't fail, the original 03 is prone to failure, so it's looking more and more like a oil pump failure.

Still, the Low Pressure oil should still be checked. The needle does take time to shoot up, and it only goes on after 5-7 PSI, and normal start up does have more low pressure oil. If the pressure is too low, the HPOP will not get enough oil in the reservoir to fill the reservoir and no matter how healthy the HPOP is, then it still cant compensete for a lack of oil.
 
#20 ·
I have an 03 build date truck! It's an early 04 with ICP sensor located in the annoying spot behind the turbo. When I unplug my ICP sensor I do not get a base of 500 psi. That trick only works on 04.5+ build date trucks.

If my HPOP is bad I find it very coincidental that it went out on me when I was rebuilding the engine. HPOP never showed a single sign it was going out. I'm curious if the check ball bearing on the side of my hpop fell out when I rotated my engine (this is an early build date six liter thing)

I need to figure out how to test LPOP and do that next before anything else.

If low pressure checks out, anyone have a recommendation for HPOP and where to buy it from?
 
#21 ·
Got it to early. I misread what you had typed a few posts back.

I agree that - with how you state it - that the HPOP going while down is odd/unlikely. The problem is - if it isn't a leak - that leaves the LPOP, an electrical issue, or the HPOP screen or pump.

There is an oil test port on the front center of the oil cooler housing. You can get the pressure there.



Any AutoZone-ish oil pressure sensor would do. ...or something off of eBay.
 
  • Like
Reactions: katoom
#23 ·
  • Like
Reactions: katoom
#25 ·
I just got my cap in today and it was a fuel filter cap and not an oil filter cap :|

I pulled the oil filter cap and pressed down on the drain back valve with a screw driver and I had oil building in the filter housing pretty quick. I think I'm about to pull the trigger on an hpop.

Do you think I've determined my low pressure is good or should I buy the correct cap and wait a few days for it to come in?
 
#26 ·
I just put a new long block in a 04 and had the same problem. The high oil pressure would not go over 300 psi. Finally I figured out the crank and cam sensor was not ( cant remember the word) Sin ficm working together. my problem was a bad connection on the crank sensor. but if you pulled out the cam sensor make sure it is seated in to the block all the way. do not let the bolt draw it in to the block push it in by hand. If these are not reading together the IPR will not close enough to get pressure.
 
#27 · (Edited)
Big update: Got 1800 icp while cranking today. Finally getting enough pressure for my injectors to fire and there is some smoke coming out the exhaust while cranking.

Hairball- found a broken connector on the crank sensor... That was my culprit

I cranked on it quite a bit and couldn't get it to run. My batteries are severly discharged and I need to let them sit on the charger for a while. The truck is still taking 5 seconds or so to build low pressure oil and it's making a strange noise while cranking. I'll upload a video shortly.
 
This is an older thread, you may not receive a response, and could be reviving an old thread. Please consider creating a new thread.
Top